422 1 BEFORE THE OHIO POWER SITING BOARD 2 ________________________________ 3 In the Matter of the Application 4 of Frasier Solar, LLC for a Case No. 5 Certificate of Environmental 23-796-EL-BGN 6 Compatibility and Public Need 7 to Construct a Solar-Powered 8 Electric Generation Facility. 9 ________________________________ 10 HEARING 11 DAY 3 12 DATE: Wednesday, May 29, 2024 13 TIME: 5:00 p.m. 14 BEFORE: Attorney Examiner David Hicks 15 Attorney Examiner Matthew Sandor 16 Attorney Examiner Manette Asta 17 LOCATION: Knox Memorial Theater 18 112 East High Street 19 Mount Vernon, OH 43050 20 REPORTED BY: Nic Joseph 21 JOB NO.: 6665493 22 23 24 25 423 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 ON BEHALF OF APPLICANT FRASIER SOLAR, LLC: 3 MICHAEL SETTINERI, ESQUIRE 4 JOSHUA R. ECKERT, ESQUIRE 5 Vorys, Sater, Seymour & Pease LLP 6 52 East Gay Street 7 P.O. Box 1008 8 Columbus, OH 43215 9 mjsettineri@vorys.com 10 jreckert@vorys.com 11 (614) 464-5462 12 13 ON BEHALF OF INTERVENOR OHIO ENVIRONMENTAL COUNCIL: 14 CHRIS TAVENOR, ESQUIRE (by videoconference) 15 The Ohio Environmental Council 16 1145 Chesapeake Avenue, Suite I 17 Columbus, OH 43212 18 ctavenor@theoec.org 19 (614) 487-7506 20 21 22 23 24 25 424 1 A P P E A R A N C E S (Cont'd.) 2 ON BEHALF OF INTERVENORS KNOX SMART DEVELOPMENT AND 3 JARED YOST: 4 DOUGLAS HOLTHUS, ESQUIRE 5 Freeman Mathis & Gary 6 65 East State Street, Suite 2550 7 Columbus, OH 43215 8 doug.holthus@fgmlaw.com 9 (614) 683-8411 10 11 ALSO PRESENT: 12 Jennifer French, Chair of the Ohio Power Siting 13 Board 14 Gene Philips, Designee for the Ohio Department of 15 Health 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 425 1 I N D E X 2 WITNESSES: DX CX RDX RCX 3 ANDREA STEWART 433 4 5 ANTONIO DITOMMASO 437 6 By Mr. Holthus 440 7 8 BILL BOGANTZ 444 9 10 SCOTT SMITH 449 11 12 LYNN ROWE 452 13 14 SALLIE BOWEN 456 15 By Mr. Settineri 461 16 17 JASON ROW 462 18 By Mr. Settineri 466 19 20 ROGER MCCONNELL 477 21 By Mr. Settineri 481 22 23 MARY BEBOUT 487 24 25 JULIET STRINKA 492 426 1 I N D E X (Cont'd) 2 WITNESSES: DX CX RDX RCX 3 DANIEL PETERS 497 4 5 MICHAEL MILLER 500 6 By Mr. Settineri 502 7 8 DEREK POSEY 510 9 10 CRAIG COLOPY 515 11 12 BETH BARTLEY 522 13 By Mr. Settineri 524 14 15 KARI THOMAS 528 16 By Mr. Settineri 531 17 18 RHONDA NOBLE 536 19 By Mr. Settineri 540 20 By Mr. Tavenor 552 21 22 KAREN SCHMITT 556 23 By Mr. Settineri 560 24 By Mr. Tavenor 563 25 427 1 I N D E X (Cont'd) 2 WITNESSES: DX CX RDX RCX 3 BRENDA MCCAMENT 567 4 By Mr. Settineri 570 5 6 RICK MCCAMENT 573 7 By Mr. Settineri 575 8 9 SUSAN MOORE 579 10 By Mr. Settineri 582 11 12 PATTI DICE 587 13 By Mr. Settineri 592 14 15 SARAH ANN DEAN 594 16 By Mr. Settineri 597 17 18 POLLY HOCOTT 604 19 20 HANNAH GLEESPEN 607 21 By Mr. Settineri 609 22 23 CANDACE HOCOTT 614 24 By Mr. Settineri 616 25 428 1 I N D E X (Cont'd) 2 WITNESSES: DX CX RDX RCX 3 EMILY ROWLEY 620 4 5 JOHNNY HOCOTT 626 6 By Mr. Settineri 628 7 8 SAMUEL GLEESPEN 631 9 By Mr. Settineri 632 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 429 1 E X H I B I T S 2 NO. DESCRIPTION ID/EVD 3 Frasier: 4 Exhibit PH1 Frasier Solar Map, Thomas' 5 Address Marked 533/535 6 Exhibit PH2 Frasier Solar Map, Nobles' 7 Address Marked 543/554 8 Exhibit PH3 Letter in Opposition to 9 Frasier Solar, Beth Bartley 545/554 10 Exhibit PH4 Preserve Knox County Website 11 Printout 547/554 12 Exhibit PH5 Letter in Opposition to 13 Frasier Solar, Karen Schmitt 561/565 14 Exhibit PH6 Letter in Opposition to 15 Frasier Solar, Karen Schmitt 561/565 16 Exhibit PH7 Frasier Solar Map, Deans' 17 Address Marked 599/603 18 Exhibit PH8 Google Map Printout 6041 19 Sharp Road 600/603 20 Exhibit PH9 Frasier Solar Map, Gleespens' 21 Address Marked 610/612 22 Exhibit PH10 Frasier Solar Map, Holcotts' 23 Address Marked 617/618 24 25 430 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 JUDGE HICKS: We'll go ahead and go on 3 the record. I want to welcome everyone here again. 4 We are reconvening for round three in the local public 5 hearing on case number 23-796-EL-BGN, which is In the 6 Matter of the Application of Frasier Solar, LLC for a 7 Certification of Environmental Compatibility and 8 Public Need. 9 My name is David Hicks. With me once 10 again is Matt Sandor and Manette Asta. And we are the 11 administrative law judges assigned to hear this case. 12 I also want to introduce with us, again, is the chair 13 of the Ohio Power Siting Board, Jennifer French, and 14 on her left, as designee for the Ohio Department of 15 Health, is Gene Phillips. 16 Just a couple of quick introductory 17 comments again, sort of like I did last week, and 18 we'll take appearances of counsel. I just want to 19 reiterate that everything we had said previously in 20 the last two sessions still applies. The limit of 21 five minutes for your testimony. We will try to flash 22 you this 30-second sign when you have 30 seconds. 23 Sometimes I know people don't see it because you're 24 looking down, but we are going to, once again, cut you 25 off at the five minutes just to stay consistent with 431 1 what we've done with everyone up until now. 2 Just, once again, not a 3 question-and-answer session. If it's your turn to 4 talk, if you have questions, please feel free. There 5 are representatives from the company here down front, 6 which I'm sure would be happy to speak with you or 7 board staff at the entrance there when you came in. 8 Also please refrain from the clapping and cheering. 9 It just makes it difficult to keep things going and 10 also hard on our court reporter who is trying to get 11 an accurate transcript. 12 With that, I want to go ahead and 13 take -- we can just do brief appearances. I think 14 everyone down here has been here at some point, but 15 brief appearances from the parties. 16 MR. SETTINERI: Good evening, Your 17 Honors. On behalf of Frasier Solar LLC, Michael 18 Settineri and Josh Eckert, Law Firm of Vorys Sater 19 Seymour & Pease. 20 MR. TAVENOR: Good evening, Your 21 Honors. Chris Tavenor, on behalf of Ohio 22 Environmental Council. 23 MR. HOLTHUS: Doug Holthus, with 24 Freeman Mathis & Gary, on behalf of KSD and Jared 25 Yost. 432 1 JUDGE HICKS: Thank you. Okay. 2 Anything from counsel before we get it going here? 3 Okay. We are going to just go down the 4 order of the names that were attached to the entry 5 that came out. These are the folks that are scheduled 6 to testify tonight. And with that, we will begin. 7 JUDGE ASTA: Andrea Stewart. Please 8 raise your right hand. Do you swear that the 9 testimony you are about to provide is the truth? 10 MS. STEWART: I do. 11 JUDGE ASTA: And please state and spell 12 your name for the record. 13 THE WITNESS: My name is Andrea 14 Stewart, A-N-D-R-E-A S-T-E-W-A-R-T. 15 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 16 including township? 17 THE WITNESS: 7193 Possum Street, Mount 18 Vernon, Ohio, Liberty Township. 19 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 20 the project area? 21 THE WITNESS: No. 22 JUDGE ASTA: Are you a member of an 23 intervening group in this proceeding? 24 THE WITNESS: No. 25 JUDGE ASTA: You may proceed. 433 1 DIRECT STATEMENT 2 THE WITNESS: Okay. My name is Andrea 3 Stewart. I oppose the Frasier Solar Project. I live 4 approximately one mile from the proposed site. 5 My concerns are property values will 6 decrease. Deer population and health, as we use the 7 deer as a food source. Drinking water. We are on a 8 well, and I am concerned about the contaminated 9 runoff. The propensity of fire and the chemicals that 10 would be used to extinguish that fire. The glare that 11 would affect the airplanes flying in and out of Knox 12 County Airport, as I understand those board of 13 directors is also against this project. 14 It is also my understanding that if 15 Frasier or Open Roads would go out of business, as 16 many solar companies do, the landowner is then 17 reliable -- is liable for the remaining equipment and 18 any liens that are on the property. We have solar 19 panels. And, in fact, the company that we used, 20 Freedom Solar, went out of business, and a subsequent 21 company went out of business. Further to that, we 22 were promised a return on investment, which we have 23 not seen from our solar panels. 24 Let me clarify. I absolutely support 25 farmers and their rights. However, farmland is for 434 1 farming, not industrial solar fields. The farmers 2 should petition to have their land rezoned just as any 3 other landowner would be required to do. 4 I do have a question. I spoke with a 5 landscape architect at the meeting of the Naz last 6 year. She's from New York City. She's planting the 7 vegetation. I'd like to know why locals were not 8 hired. 9 Lastly, I'd like to congratulate the 10 Village of Gambier in their foresight to protect their 11 farmland through zoning. Here are just a few of the 12 excerpts from their zoning ordinance document. "Their 13 purpose is to protect landowners from adverse impacts 14 in adjoining developments, to conserve the natural 15 environment, and to achieve the efficient use of land 16 without major disruption of the natural environment." 17 The Village of Gambier's zoning also 18 goes on to talk about solar. It says that, "The solar 19 shall be placed such that the solar glare shall not be 20 directed onto nearby properties. They cannot exceed 21 250 feet." 22 They talk about a mixed-use district 23 and that they want to protect adjacent residential, 24 institutional, and business developments and the 25 general public by restricting the types of uses which 435 1 could be hazardous, noisy, have glare, odor, or any 2 other objectionable influences. They have good 3 neighbor standards. The purpose of these is to 4 protect the Village in general and the neighboring 5 landowners from any potential and negative impacts 6 that uses may have on the physical environment or the 7 quality of the -- enjoyed by Gambier. 8 For additional protections, the Village 9 of Gambier also has a Philander Chase Conservancy, 10 which was formed in the year 2000, to protect farmland 11 in the area. It protects 5,600 acres. Its purpose is 12 to conserve open space in a five-mile radius 13 surrounding Kenyon College. It works with farmers, 14 landowners, and environmental groups to ensure the 15 rural character of the surrounding area is maintained. 16 Kenyon College is the only college or 17 university in the country to establish its own land 18 trust. Its mission is to protect the natural beauty 19 of the farms and spaces surrounding Kenyon College and 20 to preserve the rural character of the region at 21 large. The Local Agriculture Easement Purchase 22 Program, L-A-E-P-P, has allowed farmers to sell their 23 rights to future non-agricultural development to 24 Philander Chase Conservancy in order to keep the land 25 in agricultural use in perpetuity. The state pays a 436 1 portion of that. 2 Now I understand why so many Gambier 3 folks are in favor of industrial solar in our area. 4 They don't want it in their backyard. 5 JUDGE ASTA: Ms. Stewart? Ms. Stewart? 6 If you can come back up -- 7 MR. SETTINERI: There will be no 8 questions. 9 JUDGE ASTA: Oh, there are no 10 questions. 11 MS. STEWART: No questions? 12 JUDGE ASTA: But for our remaining 13 witnesses, if you could please remain at the stand so 14 that counsel has the opportunity to ask questions. 15 Moving on, we have Janet Core [ph]. 16 Hearing none, Antonio diTommaso. 17 MR. DITOMMASO: Good evening. 18 JUDGE ASTA: Please raise your right 19 hand. Do you swear that the testimony you're about to 20 provide is the truth? 21 MR. DITOMMASO: Yes. 22 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 23 your name for the record. 24 THE WITNESS: Antonio diTommaso, Jr. 25 A-N-T-O-N-I-O D-I-capital T-O-M-M-A-S-O. 437 1 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 2 including township? 3 THE WITNESS: 107 Drummond Avenue, 4 Hubbard, Ohio. 5 JUDGE ASTA: Do you live or work in the 6 project area? 7 THE WITNESS: Work. 8 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 9 intervening group to this proceeding? 10 THE WITNESS: No. 11 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 12 DIRECT STATEMENT 13 THE WITNESS: I'll put this here so I 14 don't forget. I'd like to first thank the Ohio Power 15 Siting Board for their diligence to allow all those 16 that came prepared to speak the opportunity to do so. 17 I've already told you my name. 18 I'm a representative of the Central 19 Midwest Regional Council of Carpenters. We have 130 20 brothers and sisters who live in Knox County, and may 21 not have been able to attend these areas due to their 22 working hours are longer, their traveling farther, so 23 I came to speak on their behalf. Part of this is due 24 to a lot of the growth that's going on in Ohio. We're 25 booming. There's a lot of work going, and our members 438 1 are traveling farther and working longer hours. 2 So I'm sure we've all heard the myths 3 about the runoffs, including into the waters, and all 4 that stuff. Our members don't want to live in those 5 backyards if they're polluting themselves. Ohio 6 doesn't want to do that either. 7 You know, solar has been proven to be a 8 safe -- solar panels have proven to be safe 9 alternatives to the power of our future. But what 10 most of us fail to see here is that -- sorry, I lost 11 my place. Let me get back here. Change is 12 uncomfortable, and most people, including big 13 business, do not like or want change. But what most 14 fail to see is that change provides opportunity. 15 And opportunity is what I would like to 16 talk to you about tonight. The Central Midwest 17 Carpenters represent over 34,000 carpenters, 18 millwrights, piledrivers, floor layers living in Ohio, 19 Kentucky, and Indiana. Our members have installed 20 over three gigawatts of solar, with over 5,000 trained 21 members, who have received training in one of our 13 22 training centers. 23 We've also opened up doors for high 24 school students to get training hours on our 25 curriculum, not just in solar, but other things, 439 1 through a thing called Career Connections. There's 2 over 183 schools in Ohio alone that are signed in 3 this. And that allows juniors and seniors in high 4 school to get credits towards their apprenticeship 5 program, which would also allow them the opportunity 6 to create an associate's degree in industrial applied 7 science if they fulfill our apprenticeship program. 8 So projects like Frasier's Solar can 9 provide an opportunity for Knox County Career Center, 10 whose scientists -- that those students to start a 11 career with carpenters by partnering with the United 12 Brotherhood of Carpenters, where they can receive 13 solar installation training along with the rest of the 14 curriculum while earning a living wage. We were given 15 a good example of this at our first meeting with the 16 young lady from Portsmouth, who has been doing solar 17 installation for the past three years and told us how 18 she struggled to provide for her children before these 19 opportunities were made available. And she is hoping 20 to have the opportunity to work on the Frasier 21 Project. 22 So I'm asking Frasier Solar to commit 23 to using local skilled workers who have an invested 24 interest in the project and their community, as well 25 as the board and the community to support an 440 1 investment being made in this community and receive 2 the benefits and opportunity that the Frasier Solar 3 Project can provide. That's my testimony. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 5 Any questions for this witness? Yes? 6 MR. HOLTHUS: -- testimony. 7 CROSS-EXAMINATION 8 BY MR. HOLTHUS: 9 Q Mr. diTommaso, my name is Doug Holthus. I 10 represent an intervening group and a landowner. 11 A Pardon? 12 Q And one of the landowners. 13 A Okay. 14 Q And a -- do I understand that Frasier has 15 not yet committed to union labor on this project? 16 A That's not of my knowledge. I'm just coming 17 here on my own behalf to represent my members. 18 Q Sure. But there's no guarantee that Frasier 19 has wanted to hire any of your union labor brothers 20 and sisters to perform any work on this project. 21 A I'm not asking for union. I'm asking for 22 skilled workers to perform the work on this project to 23 make money here, spend money here, and create jobs and 24 opportunities for the future. 25 Q Didn't you just say you wanted Frasier to 441 1 commit -- 2 A To using local skilled workers. 3 Q Local skilled workers. So Frasier hasn't 4 done that yet. 5 A I don't know that, sir. 6 Q Okay. And you don't live in the area? 7 A Pardon? 8 Q You don't live in the area? 9 A I don't live in Knox County, but I do work. 10 Q Where are you working now? 11 A Currently right here. 12 Q Doing what? 13 A Representing solar opportunities. 14 Q No, I mean working to earn a wage. Where 15 are you working? 16 A I work in Indiana, Kentucky, and Ohio. 17 Q Are you working in Knox County currently? 18 A When I'm in the area, yes. 19 Q Are you currently working, earning a wage in 20 Knox County, Ohio? 21 A Sir, my job is to go throughout the entire 22 area, and, yes, I do go on projects in Knox County. I 23 go to schools in Knox County. I go wherever I'm 24 necessary. My boss tells me, "Get up today, Tony, and 25 go to Rossford." 442 1 Q Are you currently working, applying your 2 trade, earning a wage in Knox County, Ohio? 3 A I would say yes, as I'm representing my 4 members. 5 Q Where are you working? Using a nail gun or 6 anything the carpenters do. 7 A You misunderstand. 8 Q No, I don't. I think you're 9 misunderstanding my question. 10 JUDGE HICKS: Your Honor, if I may, he 11 may want to ask what position -- 12 MR. SANDOR: I think you've made your 13 point. 14 MR. HOLTHUS: All right. Thank you. 15 I'll move on. 16 BY MR. HOLTHUS: 17 Q You mentioned the myths of solar power, 18 correct? 19 A Yeah, I mentioned it, yes. 20 Q What is your basis for saying that facts are 21 myths? 22 A Again, I don't know how to answer that, sir. 23 I know that there are misinformation on both sides of 24 the field on this, and that's why I just said myths in 25 general. I'm not here to debate facts. You might 443 1 know them better. 2 MR. HOLTHUS: Okay. thank you. I have 3 nothing else. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you for your 5 testimony. 6 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 7 JUDGE ASTA: Next is Bill Bogantz. 8 Please raise your right hand. Do you 9 swear that the testimony you're about to provide is 10 the truth? 11 MR. BOGANTZ: Yes. 12 JUDGE ASTA: Please state your name for 13 the record. 14 THE WITNESS: Bill, B-I-L-L, Bogantz, 15 B-O-G-A-N-T-Z. 16 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 17 including township? 18 THE WITNESS: 4709 Sportsman's Club 19 Road, Johnstown, Ohio, Liberty Township, Licking 20 County. 21 JUDGE ASTA: So do you work in the 22 project area? 23 THE WITNESS: I do not. 24 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of 25 any intervening party? 444 1 THE WITNESS: I am not. 2 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 3 DIRECT STATEMENT 4 THE WITNESS: Okay. I am Bill Bogantz. 5 I am a township trustee in Liberty Township in Licking 6 County, Ohio. Though I live in Licking County, I 7 wanted to speak tonight to support our neighbors to 8 the north here in Knox County. 9 Solar farms, such as the proposed 10 Frasier Project, are wanted by only a handful of 11 people: Those that are selling or leasing their land 12 to companies such as Open Roads Renewables and others 13 who will profit from those projects, such as the 14 unions that are represented here tonight and that have 15 spoken the previous two nights. How many of these 16 union representatives and workers live here in Knox 17 County? I suspect none of them do. How many of them 18 live close to the project area? I suspect none of 19 them do. 20 It's easy to support something that you 21 only profit from. And I'm not against unions. My 22 father was a carpenter president of the Carpenters 23 Union in Mansfield, Ohio for 20 years. Then you have 24 the so-called conservative groups from Ohio Land and 25 Liberty Coalition. They send a team from Columbus to 445 1 Knox County to advocate for the Frasier Solar Project. 2 How many of them live near -- anywhere near a solar 3 project? I suspect none of them do. Again, it is 4 easy to support something that does not negatively 5 impact you. 6 Most of the landowners profiting from 7 these contracts do not even live adjacent to the 8 project area, and many do not even live in the county. 9 My understanding is that eight of the nine landowners 10 that have contracted with Open Road Renewables for the 11 Frasier Project do not live near the project, and four 12 of them do not even live in the county. Hence, they 13 have no vested interest in preserving the land and no 14 vested interest in protecting the property values of 15 the neighboring homes and properties. 16 Some argue property owners' rights, 17 arguing that a landowner should be allowed to do with 18 their land whatever they please, whatever profits 19 then. I understand that argument, and I largely agree 20 with that argument. However, I disagree with this 21 philosophy when a property owner decides to do 22 something that negatively impacts their neighbors. 23 That is why we have zoning. Township zoning is there 24 to protect the community, protect owners' rights. And 25 owners' rights are already governed by the state, 446 1 county, and township zoning regulations. 2 What about the property owners' rights 3 for those who own property near these facilities? The 4 property values will fall because of the Frasier Solar 5 Project. In March of 2023, Inside Climate News cited 6 a study conducted by Lawrence Berkeley National 7 Laboratory. The study analyzed the sales prices of 8 1.8 million homes near utility-scale solar plants in 9 six states. 10 At first glance, the report does not 11 look terrible. The report suggests that, on average, 12 home values within one half mile of the project are 13 negatively impacted by only 1.5 percent. That's a 14 loss of $7,500 on a $500,000 home. On the surface, 15 that doesn't sound bad, but it's still a loss. 16 However, reading the study more closely 17 reveals that in three of the states in the study, the 18 impact was negligible, one of those states being 19 California. And in the other three states, Minnesota 20 and North Carolina and New Jersey, there was a 21 significant impact. I would argue that we are much 22 more like North Carolina than we are California. 23 North Carolina homes within one half 24 mile of the project area had, on average, a 5.8 25 percent reduction in property values. That is a loss 447 1 of $29,000 on a $500,000 home. Considering the margin 2 of error in the analysis, the impact could be as high 3 as 8.75 percent or a $40,000 loss on a $500,000 home. 4 Also, I'll note, they didn't consider the homes within 5 a half mile. This was beyond a half mile because the 6 impact was much greater. It was not quoted in the 7 report. 8 In addition to being a township 9 trustee, I'm also a full-time real estate broker. And 10 I know firsthand the impact that these facilities have 11 on property values. It's real. I am happy to report 12 that our county commissioners in Lincoln County 13 approved our township's request to designate Liberty 14 Township as an exclusionary zone for large solar. 15 I am here tonight to ask that the Ohio 16 Power Siting Board not approve the Frasier Solar 17 Project. Thank you. 18 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 19 Any questions for this witness? 20 Thank you for your testimony. 21 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 22 JUDGE ASTA: Next is Scott Smith. 23 Please raise your right hand. 24 MR. SMITH: Scott Smith. 25 JUDGE ASTA: Oh, please raise your 448 1 right hand. 2 MR. SMITH: Oh, sorry about that. 3 JUDGE ASTA: No, you're good. Do you 4 swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to 5 provide is the truth? 6 MR. SMITH: Yes. 7 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 8 your name for the record. 9 THE WITNESS: My name is Scott Smith. 10 Do you want my address? 11 JUDGE ASTA: Yes, including township. 12 THE WITNESS: Okay. 783 South Ridge 13 Drive, Mount Vernon, Ohio. 14 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 15 the project area? 16 THE WITNESS: No. I live close to 17 that. 18 JUDGE ASTA: And are you -- 19 THE WITNESS: It's within eyesight. 20 JUDGE ASTA: Are you a member of an 21 intervening party? 22 THE WITNESS: Pardon? 23 JUDGE ASTA: Are you a member of an 24 intervening group tonight? 25 THE WITNESS: No, I'm not. 449 1 JUDGE ASTA: You can proceed. 2 DIRECT STATEMENT 3 THE WITNESS: Okay. Using solar on 4 agricultural land does not make good common sense. 5 Therefore, taking out currently good producing 6 agricultural ground. There's a lot of places to put 7 solar panels that aren't used for agriculture or 8 forestation. 9 Our natural resources are important and 10 should be not taken for granted. There are many 11 technologies out there that are more efficient and 12 offer far greater benefits for the power industry. 13 You cannot replace a forest overnight, which provides 14 carbon balance that we're all concerned about. 15 Forests offer a natural cooling effect for the Earth. 16 They also offer a cleaning effect for our air that we 17 breathe. 18 Currently, China is building multiple 19 coal-fired power plants to produce solar panels for 20 the USA. It does not make sense to create a product 21 of low-efficiency return for electricity, as well as 22 using high-polluting fossil fuel to manufacture a 23 panel. Globally, there are food shortages. We need 24 to be good stewards of our agricultural land. Once 25 you take away for 40 years, it is very hard to get it 450 1 back. 2 For example, look at what's happened to 3 our forests. By clearcutting and not putting back or 4 maintaining, it is causing a lot of climate 5 destabilization on the world today. Our resources are 6 very valuable and should be taken care of here in the 7 USA. 8 We need to use common sense for 9 creating and protecting our future environment for the 10 future generation. We have become a society that 11 looks for what we can get today and do not consider 12 what happens tomorrow. Jobs for construction, they're 13 only temporary, until the projects are complete. Like 14 buying a new car, once it gets used, it's gone. 15 Solar power is a temporary supplement 16 with sunny, clear weather. They provide a little more 17 energy for consumption. However, when night comes, 18 bad weather comes, or cloudy conditions develop, they 19 do not produce. But the interesting thing is power 20 demand does not stop. Do you want to wait until the 21 sun comes out to take a shower or turn on your lights? 22 Also, if you have a snowstorm, do you 23 want to wait until the snow melts off before you can 24 use electric again? Think about it. Just recently, a 25 hailstorm took out a solar field in Texas. Do the 451 1 people in Texas want to live without electricity until 2 they replace them? 3 Have you ever seen what happens to a 4 person who has a cell phone that cannot get recharged 5 when they want it? Not a good thing. Also, solar 6 panels are very expensive to recycle. 7 In closing, solar appears to not be a 8 very smart idea for our producing agricultural system 9 in short term. Therefore, I oppose the solar project 10 in this area, Project Number 23-0796-EL-BGN. Thank 11 you. 12 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 13 Any questions? 14 Thank you for your testimony. 15 Next is Lynn Rowe. 16 MR. ROWE: Good evening. 17 JUDGE ASTA: Please raise your right 18 hand. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony 19 you're about to provide is the truth? 20 MR. ROWE: I do. 21 JUDGE ASTA: And please state and spell 22 your name for the record. 23 THE WITNESS: Lynn G. Rowe, address 24 13825 Sycamore Road, Mount Vernon, Ohio. 25 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 452 1 the project area? 2 THE WITNESS: You've got to speak up a 3 little, ma'am. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Do you live or work in the 5 project area? 6 THE WITNESS: No. 7 JUDGE ASTA: Are you a member of an 8 intervening party tonight? 9 THE WITNESS: No. 10 JUDGE ASTA: Please proceed. 11 DIRECT STATEMENT 12 THE WITNESS: I have a resolution here. 13 I'm a Miller Township trustee. Resolution Number 14 2024-04-01, a resolution stating the opposition of the 15 Miller Township Board of Trustees to the Open Road 16 Renewables Large Solar Facility Project known as 17 Frasier Solar LLC. Whereas, pending before the Ohio 18 Power Citing Board is the purpose for your solar 19 energy development project intended to be located in 20 Knox County, mostly within the boundaries of Miller 21 Township and whereas the Board of Trustees of the 22 Miller Township trustees, Knox County, Ohio, that has 23 responsibility for supporting the preservation of the 24 general health, safety, welfare, rural integrity, 25 agriculture priorities, and listening to the community 453 1 input within the boundaries of the township. 2 Whereas the board has considered the 3 potential impacts of the Frasier Solar Energy Project 4 as well as interest of property owners in making their 5 land available for development and whereas it is the 6 recruit to the above concerns, the board has 7 determined that the development of Frasier Solar 8 Energy Project is not in the best interest of the 9 citizens and the community at large. 10 And, whereas the township wishes to 11 document its position via resolution to the Ohio Power 12 Citing Board. And, whereas the township wishes to 13 document its position via resolution to aid and 14 provide guidance to the Board of County Commissioners 15 of Knox County in making decisions under the authority 16 granted to them by law and representing the interest 17 of the township in letters and to the public hearings 18 before the Ohio Power Citing Board. 19 Now for, upon motion by Lynn Rowe, 20 second by Jason Row, be it resolved that the Board of 21 Trustees Miller Township, Knox County, Ohio, that the 22 board has hereby expresses its opposition to the 23 pending request before the Ohio Power Siting Board to 24 approve the development and operation of Frasier Solar 25 Energy Development Project in Knox County and request 454 1 such developments be denied. The Board of Trustees of 2 Miller Township Trustees, Knox County, Ohio, does 3 hereby find that it is the best interest of the Miller 4 Township to request that the Knox County Board of 5 Commissioners oppose the development of Frasier Solar 6 LLC project by Open Road Renewables. 7 The township physical officer Gary 8 Small or his designee is authorized and directed to 9 transmit a copy of this resolution to the Knox County 10 Board of Commissioners for its consideration. The 11 resolution shall be in full force and effective 12 immediately upon its adoption. Voting A, Jason Row, 13 Roger McConnell, Lynn Rowe. Voting A, none. Attested 14 by Gary Small, Township physical officer. Dated 15 4/1/2024. 16 Now, I have an email from Joe Zimmerman 17 [ph]. He's Knox County Airport Authority. He's the 18 president. "As your local elected official in the 19 proximity of Knox County Airport, I wanted to share 20 with you a recent resolution passed unanimously by the 21 Airport Board regarding the proposed industrial solar 22 fields nearby. In addition to the resolution, the 23 reference material from the FAA and summary and letter 24 from me are included. 25 "I would like for you and your township 455 1 to be aware of our findings and our firm stance on the 2 side of safety and caution of this matter. Feel free 3 to share with your colleagues who are also elected 4 officials for the township. Thank you for your time 5 and consideration, Joe Zimmerman [ph], KCRAA, Knox 6 County Airport of Ohio." I've got 30 seconds? 7 JUDGE HICKS: Right. 8 THE WITNESS: Okay. I've got the 9 resolution here. It is signed by Chip McConville, 10 prosecuting attorney of Knox County. It's a two-page 11 resolution. I won't have time to read it. I don't 12 read that fast, but it's here. It'll be in the box, 13 along with everything else. Thank you for your time. 14 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you, Mr. Rowe. 15 Any questions for this witness? 16 MR. SETTINERI: No questions. 17 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you for your 18 testimony. 19 Next is Sallie Bowen. 20 Please raise your right hand. Do you 21 swear that the testimony you're about to provide is 22 the truth? 23 MS. BOWEN: Yes. 24 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 25 your name for the record. 456 1 THE WITNESS: Sallie Bowen, S-A-L-L-I-E 2 B-O-W-E-N. 3 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 4 including the township? 5 THE WITNESS: It's 2821 Berger Road, 6 Mount Vernon, and it's in Miller Township. 7 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 8 the project area? 9 THE WITNESS: Just down the street. 10 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 11 intervening party tonight? 12 THE WITNESS: No, I'm not. 13 JUDGE ASTA: You may proceed. 14 DIRECT STATEMENT 15 THE WITNESS: Okay. Do you all recall 16 at the beginning of COVID when things were unknown and 17 lots of these unknowns were kind of made us fearful? 18 Shortly after the beginning of the crisis came a man 19 who took center stage, appearing to be the expert, who 20 gave us many assurances to quiet our fears, followed 21 by a company or two who made safe and effective 22 promises to us about their products, assuring us into 23 accepting their untried medical products. 24 These safe and effective products are 25 now being revealed to be the damaging and destructive 457 1 products that they have always been. It's just the 2 majority of people couldn't see through the 3 gaslighting to the truth. For me personally, that 4 reminds me to some degree of what is being proposed by 5 Frasier Solar and Open Road Renewable currently. 6 Out of nowhere, these folks appeared in 7 our small towns, putting up storefronts along our main 8 streets and suddenly financing a whole host of our 9 small-town events, slowly working their way into our 10 consciousness. There were a lot of appearances to the 11 public of being straight shooters and potential good 12 neighbors until reports of hush money payments 13 surfaced here in our community. Money given to 14 silence our neighbors, who were not amenable to these 15 large out-of-state solar farm projects they propose 16 near them. 17 Have you asked yourself why these 18 companies would need to bribe our fellow neighbors 19 into silence to move along their agendas? So much for 20 honesty and transparency from these two companies. 21 That is neither acceptable nor is that of a business. 22 And then came news that these solar 23 farms would be constructed on farm grounds so 24 agricultural, not commercial, near all of us. We 25 belatedly learned that the state in 2021 passed State 458 1 Bill 52. Of course, at a time when we all were more 2 focused on getting through COVID than anything else. 3 And that this enabled townships and county officials 4 to decide if they wanted to exclude industrial sized 5 wind and solar projects from the rural areas. 6 One of the Open Road Renewable 7 representatives, who is ever present in our community, 8 began to promote his proposed solar farm project to 9 us, stating it would generate "clean, quiet energy," 10 while listing a whole myriad of potential financial 11 benefits to our county. Forty-year contracts were 12 drawn up with our farmers and promises of funding were 13 made to our local schools and fire departments, just 14 to name a few. 15 The problem to me appears to be who is 16 providing the factual assurances being offered as 17 proof that these farms won't harm our beautiful 18 communities? In an Open Road Renewables brochure from 19 last year that was entitled "Correcting Misinformation 20 About Utility Solar Energy in Knox County," potential 21 environmental impacts of solar farms were minimized 22 with a quote from our own Ohio Department of Health 23 stating that, "Non-toxic, non-porous substances, like 24 glass, would fully encapsulate the hazardous chemicals 25 that are known to be present in these solar panels." 459 1 Well, that's well and good until the 2 components of the panels start to degrade over time, 3 and the glass is damaged, allowing the innards to 4 leach into our farmland and potentially into our 5 groundwater. Thunderstorms and tornadoes are not 6 uncommon occurrences in this part of Ohio. So what 7 assurances do we have that there won't be damage to 8 acres upon acres of glass solar panels? 9 All we need to think of are the images 10 that the gentleman mentioned just a moment ago out of 11 Texas, when the storms ripped through their region 12 earlier this year, obliterating hundreds of rows of 13 solar panels. I watched it on TV. And, I can't lie, 14 I will forever remember the cleanup crews that were 15 dressed in full hazmat suits trying hard to protect 16 their land and the groundwater. It was awful. 17 But what about the promises made to us 18 by Open Road, that there is virtually no light, noise, 19 dust, or odor with these farms? It only takes a 20 simple search on Google to see comments from those 21 living near solar projects who were given these exact 22 same assurances. But they have learned the hard way 23 that panels do make noise, as aging and rusting 24 inverters track the sun, and that they can cause 25 hideous glare that can be blinding on very sunny days. 460 1 We're told that they don't produce 2 dust, but let's just discuss the extra dust produced 3 by all of the construction vehicles during the lengthy 4 construction phase. Many of us are already not happy 5 with our old asphalt and gravel roads here. Can you 6 imagine when a constant stream of construction 7 vehicles are on our roads on a regular basis? How 8 much worse will it be then? 9 During the first of these three public 10 hearings, much mention was given to the proposal to 11 graze sheep around the panels to counter the argument 12 that the land will no longer be used for true 13 agricultural purposes that it's zoned for. This 14 sounds fine until you study the actual document 15 language. It doesn't say Open Road will be doing and 16 allowing the grazing. It's just that they have the 17 option for it. Those are two totally different 18 things. 19 They can propose it now, but they can 20 decline it later. Again, if we've learned anything -- 21 JUDGE ASTA: And that's five minutes. 22 THE WITNESS: Okay, thank you. 23 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. Just one 24 moment. 25 THE WITNESS: Sure. 461 1 MR. SETTINERI: Quick question. 2 CROSS-EXAMINATION 3 BY MR. SETTINERI: 4 Q Good evening, Ms. Bowen. Mike Settineri, on 5 behalf of Frasier Solar. Have you reviewed the staff 6 report that came out on this project? 7 A The staff report? 8 Q Yes, the Ohio -- 9 A I don't know what that is. 10 Q Are you aware the Ohio Power Siting Board 11 staff issued a report and recommendation on the 12 project? 13 A I've read that in a periodical that was 14 mailed to our home. 15 Q All right. And so you haven't reviewed the 16 conditions that were recommended for the project? 17 A No, I don't. No, I don't. 18 Q Would you like to receive a copy of that? 19 A I would. 20 Q I'm glad to send it to you. Thank you. 21 A You're very welcome. 22 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 23 Jeanine Baldrige? 24 Hearing none, Andrew Murray? 25 Hearing none, Jason Row. 462 1 Please raise your right hand. Do you 2 swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to 3 provide is the truth? 4 MR. ROW: Yes. 5 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 6 your name for the record. 7 THE WITNESS: It's Jason Row. And it's 8 J-A-S-O-N R-O-W. 9 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 10 including township? 11 THE WITNESS: 12863 Watson Road, Mount 12 Vernon, Ohio, and that's Miller Township. 13 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 14 the project area? 15 THE WITNESS: Both. I live and work in 16 it. 17 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 18 intervening party tonight? 19 THE WITNESS: No, ma'am. 20 JUDGE ASTA: You may proceed. 21 DIRECT STATEMENT 22 THE WITNESS: Okay. My name is Jason 23 Row. I'm a Miller Township trustee. I am on the Knox 24 and Soil Water Board also. And I am a five-year 25 generation person living on our farm in Miller 463 1 Township. And I am one of the three houses that will 2 be closest to the solar project proposed. 3 Over the last year and a half, it's 4 been a very stressful time at the Miller Township 5 Trustee Township meetings. We've had a lot of 6 resistance on the project. And I'll be honest with 7 you, when we first started out, all three trustees 8 were very neutral and tried to understand everything 9 that would be coming with the project. 10 But over a lot of research on some of 11 the other farms in Ohio and what we've seen on issues 12 with erosion, topsoil loss, property values 13 decreasing. All of us have done our own research and 14 heard from a lot of people, got tons of letters from 15 people in the townships -- in the township and out of 16 the township. And I'll be honest, it was probably a 17 75/25 against it to go forward. 18 So in my mind, you know, I represent 19 everybody in Miller Township, not only the landowners 20 that might want to be in a project, but the ones that 21 aren't landowners that also live in a project. So the 22 majority is telling us trustees when we passed a 23 resolution that is what we needed to do. 24 I will tell you you have some of the 25 best farmers in the state of Ohio in Miller Township. 464 1 Maybe a lot of you don't know, there's probably 50,000 2 acres tillable, I think in Knox County, if I remember 3 right, and 60,000 acres tillable in Licking County. 4 So my business that I run is a seed 5 business for a seed company. And I talked to a lot of 6 fertilizer dealers, chemical reps, other seed dealers, 7 people in the state. And most of these guys that are 8 farmers sitting in this room will tell you that Knox 9 and Licking County are the garden spots of the state 10 when reps come through because the crops are 11 excellent. So to me, why you want to pull crops out 12 of an area that does that well in the state does not 13 make good sense to me. 14 And farmers, when you think about it, a 15 lot of these people sitting in the room I don't think 16 are against solar, okay? But you've got to make a fit 17 for it somewhere. Whether it's the federal 18 government, the state government, whoever, like, when 19 you're going to grow oranges, you're not going to grow 20 oranges in the state of Ohio. You're going to grow 21 them in Florida. It's like the Corn Belt when you 22 look at it, it's in Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, and some 23 of Ohio now. So I'm saying you just need to find a 24 fit. 25 I remember a representative from solar, 465 1 they brought an engineer in, and it was this past 2 winter. He sat, as I'm sitting at the township house 3 on the right side of me, down there, and I asked him, 4 "Why don't they take any of these coal burning plants, 5 it's like down on the river, and convert them over to 6 solar plants?" And I do remember his response to me 7 is, "We looked into that, about buying some of that 8 ground close to those old facilities, clearcutting, 9 not having to lease or rent that ground, clearcutting 10 some of that, doing some work to it, putting panels 11 in, and using that old facility." 12 And that's why they need -- you know, 13 they need a place to put the power into to get it out 14 of their own grid, okay? And I understand that, but I 15 think you could find some areas that better suit for 16 solar and maybe not eat farm ground up. We lose 17 thousands of acres a year for development of houses 18 and everything else in the United States. The farm 19 ground acreage on 85 million of corn or 90, in 20 between, our own corn and beans gets knocked down 21 every year. There's just so many unknowns too. 22 I guess, talking to a few other guys, 23 they're not sure, you know, in 40 years when this 24 stuff comes out, how productive will that ground be? 25 How much organic matter will have to be added to it? 466 1 You're going to have to retile those farms completely. 2 You're not just going to fix tile. 3 So, in closing, on behalf of myself, my 4 wife, and Miller Township, we are opposing the Frasier 5 Solar Project. Thank you. 6 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 7 Any questions for this witness? 8 MR. SETTINERI: Yeah. Mr. Row -- 9 THE REPORTER: Mr. Settineri, could you 10 please not put your binder on top of my microphone? 11 THE REPORTER: Sorry. 12 MR. SETTINERI: Just trying to hide. 13 Let me lean forward here. 14 CROSS-EXAMINATION 15 BY MR. SETTINERI: 16 Q Mr. Row, Mike Settineri, on behalf of 17 Frasier Solar. It's nice to see you tonight. You 18 have a copy of that resolution from Miller Township by 19 chance? 20 A I don't have one with me, no. I put one in 21 the box right here -- copy. 22 Q The first question I had is, what do you say 23 to the landowner that can make more through solar than 24 through crops on their foundation? 25 A What do I say to them? Well, I guess I'm 467 1 going to explain to them like I explained to you about 2 the land that's being cropped or whatever. Not 3 everything's always about money. And farmers are 4 farmers, and they're good people. 5 And I really didn't appreciate you the way 6 you questioned Charlie von Zell [ph] in the very first 7 meeting. You had it out with him about the Open Road 8 Agreement, how much he wanted paid. You asked him six 9 or seven times because I wrote it down. 10 Q I don't think that was me, sir, but -- 11 A Yes, it was. I guarantee you it was. I'll 12 bet the farm on that. 13 Q Okay. Well, let me ask you this. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Just as a reminder, this 15 is for counsel to questions. 16 MR. SETTINERI: That's fine. 17 BY MR. SETTINERI: 18 Q So you didn't appreciate my prior question, 19 but going back to my question: A landowner owns 20 property, a farmer owns property. We had, I think, a 21 testimony from Mr. Dilt [ph] maybe last week, and 22 pretty emotional testimony about his decisions and 23 what he can make for income. 24 A Yeah. 25 Q And so what do you say to someone like Mr. 468 1 Dilt [ph] who, you know, if you're against the 2 project, you're taking away an opportunity for him to 3 make more off of his land than just crops? 4 A I'm going to give an opportunity to him to 5 if he's planting crops. I'm going to try to sell him 6 better seed and get better yield so he can make more 7 money for acre. That's my rebuttal to that. 8 Q Okay. Fair enough. You said you're a five- 9 year generation farmer. 10 A Yep. 11 Q What kind of agricultural activity are you 12 engaged in? 13 A I sell seed, corn, beans, wheat, hay 14 products, forages, and my son and I, we started last 15 year, he's 16, making a little hay. That was my main 16 business when I farmed. 17 Q Okay. So paraphrasing, selling seed, and 18 then also you raised a little hay? 19 A Yep. 20 Q How many acres of hay do you do? 21 A I don't know, probably 100 altogether. 22 Q Okay. 23 A But I farmed a lot more than that when I 24 farmed. 25 Q Yeah. Now, have you read the staff report 469 1 recommendation that was issued? 2 A Yes, I do. 3 Q Did you read the conditions in that? 4 A I do. And my problem with that is, is if 5 this goes through, if we can deal with you, sir, or 6 Craig all the time, but if the project gets sold, then 7 I'm just worried about how everything gets followed up 8 and taken care of, and that gets taken care of all the 9 time. 10 Q If the board approves the project and issues 11 a certificate, do you understand -- and if the board 12 adopts staff's recommended conditions, then those will 13 be permanent conditions, right? 14 A Yep. 15 Q Okay. And even if the project sold, whoever 16 holds that permit has to abide by the conditions, 17 right? 18 A Yeah. But, I mean, you're talking to people 19 like, say, farmers that deal with people face to face 20 and take care of things kind of face to face and they 21 don't want to have to go through two or three chains 22 of command. We had to deal with on -- that we fought 23 forever when they put new power lines up to get 24 everything taken care of. And we still haven't got 25 everything that we want done with that because we had 470 1 to talk to this person, that person, Roger behind me 2 took care a lot of that, and it took forever. 3 Q As a township trustee, you issue permits as 4 the township, don't you? 5 A Yep. Well, our zoning inspector issues the 6 permits. 7 Q Okay. And county engineer issues permits? 8 A Yeah. 9 Q And you expect a permit holder, that the 10 township or the county engineer issues a permit to, to 11 abide by the permit, right? 12 A That's right. 13 Q So going back to the conditions. Do you 14 believe those conditions can address some of the 15 concerns that you have with this project? 16 A I think some of the conditions in there on 17 the tile agreements and everything -- I got ground 18 right behind me -- I'm not worried about the tile 19 agreements because when that tile was put in, one the 20 gentleman that will talk about them, I'm guessing 21 later tonight, they broke hard pan on that. And where 22 that tile needs to actually be now is creating a lot 23 of runoff that goes onto them, and it's a surface 24 water runoff. It's not the tile agreements. I get 25 you'll look in the main tiles, you've got to maintain 471 1 them. But the surface water is going to be an issue. 2 Q How do you deal with surface water? 3 A Well, I suggested to Craig at a meeting or 4 whatever, if it goes in then you put a curtain drain 5 clear around that project and get it back into a main 6 or something so neighbors won't have all that runoff. 7 That's what I'm worried about. I mean, I can see that 8 being a problem because there's a lot of difference in 9 Ron Power's [ph] old ground, where it's next to the 10 gravel pit. The majority of it you've got in Miller 11 Township, it's heavy clay. I don't think you 12 understand the runoff difference that's going to 13 cause. 14 Q Let me ask this: Can surface water be 15 engineered -- can a design -- let me ask it a 16 different way. Can a design be done to address 17 surface water, such as using retention ponds, things 18 of that nature? 19 A It can be, but a lot of these -- we don't 20 get regular rainfalls anymore. Like, this spring has 21 been one of the ones in the last eight or ten years, 22 we're getting like three, four, five-tenths of rain, 23 okay? Usually, we get those inch and two-inch rains 24 that there's serious runoff out of that. 25 And I think we just run into a different 472 1 kind of spring this year and more of a regular one. 2 But we haven't had a regular one. So when you get 3 those inch or two rains, or maybe even three or four- 4 inch rains, some of those proposals would work, but 5 not for that amount of rainfall, I don't believe. 6 Q Would you, as a Miller Township trustee, be 7 willing to meet with the company and some engineers to 8 talk about the run off? 9 A We have. We met back behind the house 10 there, and there were some issues already with it 11 that's going to get even greater. But I never really 12 got anything back to know what that was going to be. 13 Q Would you be willing to continue those 14 discussions as the Miller Township Trustee? 15 A Yes, sir, I would be. 16 Q And if the Miller Township Trustees can 17 address regarding it -- let me ask it this way. If 18 the Miller Township Trustee is concerned about this, 19 it can be addressed. And I think you mentioned 20 erosion, topsoil loss, property values. Would Miller 21 Township consider reversing its position on the 22 project? 23 A No, because this is an agriculture -- I'll 24 tell you that right up. That's not going to be the 25 case. 473 1 Q Regardless of whether concern is going to be 2 addressed, Miller Township is against the project? 3 A Yes. 4 Q If you go look at that resolution, you have 5 a phrase in there in that resolution. "Rural 6 integrity," it's the second -- probably the third 7 paragraph down. It says, "whereas," and it talks 8 about the responsibility for supporting the 9 preservation of the general health, safety, welfare. 10 There's that phrase, "rural integrity." Do you see 11 that? 12 A Yep. 13 Q What does rural integrity mean to you? 14 A I guess rural integrity, yes, for the 15 ground, and make sure it's taken care of. And I feel 16 like, you know, if it's in solar -- I'm not talking 17 just about now, when you put in the solar. What's it 18 going to be down the road, and what gets taken out of 19 that ground? Because you can't honestly tell me that, 20 what's going to happen with it, what kind of 21 production it'll be when it comes to that in 40 years. 22 Q Have you read the staff condition on 23 recommended condition on soil reconditioning in the 24 project's life? 25 A Yep. Well, you must save all your questions 474 1 for me. 2 Q Not quite. 3 A Okay. 4 Q What about agricultural priorities? That 5 same phrase is used in the resolution. What does 6 agricultural priorities mean to you? 7 A Agricultural priorities? 8 Q Yeah, you see it there. 9 A I think in Knox County and in Miller 10 Township, it's agronomy production and agricultural 11 production. 12 Q Sheep, raising sheep is agriculture? 13 A Sheep, cattle, hogs, chickens, corn, beans. 14 Q And you're aware the project would have 15 sheep grazing? 16 A Yeah. 17 Q Okay. 18 A Knox County was the largest sheep producing 19 county east of the Mississippi for a lot of years, 20 thanks to Banburys and Danville. 21 Q You said the last year is pretty darn 22 stressful for the trustees. 23 A Very stressful. Yeah, it divided -- here's 24 the problem. It divided a lot of friendships and 25 families because of how they stood on this position of 475 1 this. And to me, if this hadn't happened, none of 2 that stuff would have happened between them families. 3 There's people that don't speak to people, talk to 4 people now, and I think that's terrible. 5 Q Okay. And I'm sure there are a lot of 6 concerns raised from folks that don't want the 7 project. So for instance, solar panel toxicity, was 8 that discussed in your meetings at all? 9 A Yeah, it was. And I talked to a couple fire 10 chiefs the last couple days and they can't give me a 11 straight-up answer if they had to fight it. Because 12 I'm the representative that's on the Homer Fire 13 District [ph]. If they had to fight it, they couldn't 14 give me a cost or tell me how much it would be in the 15 toxic and the suits they would need. Because I just 16 asked them for a number, so I kind of knew a little 17 bit. And they couldn't give me a straight-up number 18 because they really haven't faced it, I should say, in 19 your defense. 20 Q Okay. And then you've heard concerns about 21 leaching toxic materials in the soil and groundwater? 22 You've heard that a lot, haven't we? 23 A Yep. 24 Q What are your concerns about topsoil erode 25 loss? 476 1 A Well, in some of the other projects where 2 they have scraped it off, you know, got down to not 3 having the topsoil, I mean, when that ground, to me, 4 goes back into production, if you know anything about 5 dirt, I mean, it takes -- if you take -- I forget - 6 - an inch, the topsoil off of it, how long it takes to 7 rebuild that back up, I think, it's four to five 8 years. So when you scrape eight or ten inches off of 9 it, you're talking -- it's going to take some serious 10 time to build that back up. So even if it comes out 11 40 years, it might take 60 years before you get them 12 back to really good productive ground. 13 Q And do you realize there's, a I'll call it 14 topsoil condition, regarding managing topsoil and soil 15 during construction in the staff report? 16 A Yep, I do. 17 MR. SETTINERI: Nothing further, 18 Mr. Row. Thank you. 19 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 20 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you. 21 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 22 THE WITNESS: Anybody else? 23 JUDGE ASTA: Next is Robert McConnell. 24 MR. MCCONNELL: It's Roger McConnell's, 25 that's how I signed up. I don't know where the Robert 477 1 came from. 2 JUDGE ASTA: Oh. Please raise your 3 right hand. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony 4 you're about to provide is the truth? 5 MR. MCCONNELL: I do. 6 JUDGE ASTA: And then please state and 7 spell your name for the record. 8 THE WITNESS: Roger McConnell R-O-G-E-R 9 M-C-capital C-O-N-N-E-L-L. 10 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 11 including township? 12 THE WITNESS: 3288 Granville Road, 13 Mount Vernon, Ohio. 14 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 15 the project area? 16 THE WITNESS: Yes. I'm also a trustee 17 in the Miller Township. 18 JUDGE ASTA: Okay. And are you a 19 member of an intervening group? 20 THE WITNESS: No. 21 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 22 DIRECT STATEMENT 23 THE WITNESS: Once again, my name is 24 Roger McConnell. I'm a lifelong resident of Knox 25 County in Miller Township. My grandfather moved here 478 1 after selling his coal mine in Pennsylvania in 1924. 2 I farmed alongside my grandfather and father until 3 they passed away in 1985 and 2000. I continue to work 4 and be the caretaker of the family farm with my son, 5 Nick. 6 Once again, I'm a trustee, and we as 7 trustees have been dealing with this project -- 8 proposed project, and gathering information since we 9 found out about it quite some time ago, as it was 10 grandfathered in. There was no input from the Knox 11 County commissioners, trustees, or the community. 12 That flaw in the process was eliminated in the passing 13 of Senate Bill 52. 14 After several meetings of information 15 and discussion, I've come to the conclusion that the 16 project could cause tension between neighbors and 17 disruption within the community. I have concerns with 18 the project creating extra water runoff to neighboring 19 properties. This has happened in other solar projects 20 initiated by Open Roads. 21 To damage roads that they say they will 22 fix at the finish of the project, to extra traffic, 23 along with contractors coming in, and possibly not 24 caring about the neighboring properties and how they 25 are affected. Again, this has happened in other 479 1 projects that Open Roads Renewables have initiated. 2 We're also losing valuable farm ground 3 that produces renewable fuels. The township doesn't 4 have the manpower resources to work on the roads and 5 correct mistakes. 6 I would also like to note that there's 7 a flaw in the process, in my opinion, that all the 8 voting members are not at these hearings to listen to 9 the testimony in person. I would hope the voting 10 members of the Ohio Power Siting Board will value the 11 opinions of the local residents and people most 12 affected by this project. 13 The commissioner election results from 14 March 19th of 2024 speaks volume of the Knox County 15 residents. As much as I support rights of owners 16 committed to the project, there are also the concerns 17 for neighboring property and their rights. So after 18 careful consideration, let it be known that I do not 19 feel that this project is good for Miller Township and 20 the community. 21 Just a couple things from the staff 22 report. Topsoil being disturbed, Craig has told 23 everybody and says 5 percent, 5 percent. It says 5 24 percent, up to 20 percent, unless there's more needed 25 to be removed. 480 1 He brought in a representative from 2 Brown County. We signed up with that project down 3 there, and after she spoke for probably three or four 4 minutes, I asked -- I had asked her, "Was there 5 additional flooding and runoff because of the 6 project?" Three or four minutes went by. Finally, I 7 said, "Was there additional runoff? Yes or no? Was 8 there additional flooding? Yes or no?" "Yes, because 9 of the project." That was somebody there with him. 10 The report also notes that integrity of 11 the topsoil is disrupted once you move it and disturb 12 it. So 20 percent or more of that integrity is going 13 to be disrupted, way past my lifetime, probably past 14 my son's lifetime. 15 In the report, it also says, "Notify if 16 there's any endangered or protected species in the 17 project area, plant or animal." Blue heron crane, 18 bald eagles. So, I guess, I'm notifying you right 19 now, but that's in the project area. 20 It also says to report mortality in the 21 project. So they're anticipating mortality in the 22 project because of the solar, evidently. That's the 23 only way I can read that. 24 The word "anticipate" is in that 25 report, I don't know how many times. They don't 481 1 anticipate things. 2 I've also asked for extra money for the 3 fire department because of what Jason said. We don't 4 know how much it's going to cost, maybe $1 million for 5 a truck and phone. They want to give the fire 6 department $300,000 up front. That comes after the 7 project is completed, and so they're protecting them 8 for the right to begin with and compensation -- 9 JUDGE ASTA: And that's time. 10 THE WITNESS: Okay, that's fine. 11 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 12 Any questions for this witness? 13 CROSS-EXAMINATION 14 BY MR. SETTINERI: 15 Q Mr. McConnell, it's nice to see you. 16 A Thank you. 17 Q You mentioned some other projects initiated 18 by Open Road. Do you know the names of those 19 projects? 20 A I've talked -- I spoke with people in Brown 21 County, several people in Brown County. Actually, I 22 had a trustee farmer call me and tell me about the 23 project and the problems with that. 24 Q And when you say they "have initiated," what 25 do you -- what do you mean by "have initiated"? 482 1 A Just like this project, they're the front 2 person getting the project started, then they sell it. 3 Q So for the projects in Brown County, another 4 company would have been involved in design -- design 5 construction. 6 A Well, we don't have a design for this 7 project yet either, so it has to be somebody else. 8 Q When a residential subdivision is built, and 9 there's a multi-family development team built around 10 Mount Vernon, right? 11 A Correct. 12 Q Across from the hospital center, northeast 13 side of Mount Vernon? 14 A I'll take your word for that. 15 Q Topsoil is stripped in those kind of jobs, 16 right? 17 A I assume it is, because they have to get 18 down to a perfect foundation. 19 Q And you wouldn't expect that to return to 20 farm ground once those residential subdivision or 21 multi-family -- complex is put in, right? 22 A No, that's common sense. 23 Q Is your goal, as a township trustee, to 24 maintain agricultural character of Miller Township? 25 A My goal as a trustee, I represent the people 483 1 in the township, represent myself, and I try to come 2 to conclusion what is best for the township and the 3 community. 4 Q Going back, as a township trustee -- 5 THE REPORTER: I'm sorry, I can't hear 6 you. 7 BY MR. SETTINERI: 8 Q In regards to Miller Township, let me ask 9 you: In your opinion, is preserving the agricultural 10 character of Miller Township important to you? 11 A I think that is part of the attraction of 12 Miller Township or Knox County. So, yeah, I think 13 that agriculture is definitely a -- in my opinion, to 14 preserve the agriculture. And solar is not 15 agricultural, in my opinion. 16 Q Now, you said -- 17 JUDGE SANDOR: Please refrain -- time, 18 please. 19 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER 1: Same rules, 20 same rules. 21 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER 2: Sir, I don't 22 care, right? 23 BY MR. SETTINERI: 24 Q Mr. McConnell, just, you mentioned, at least 25 in your -- I think what you read tonight was a public 484 1 -- that's from your public comment, you put on docket 2 in the case, right? 3 A Pardon me? 4 Q Your statement tonight that you read, was 5 that the public comment? 6 A Oh, yes. 7 Q Okay. And the same question as for Mr. Row: 8 Has the last year been stressful for the Township 9 trustees in regards to this project? 10 A I would say it's stressful, but I deal with 11 stress every day in my job. So it's -- and I've dealt 12 with parents and basketball teams, so you know, 13 talking to a mom that wants their kid to play is more 14 stressful than what this has been. 15 Q Okay. And you're currently a farmer. Is 16 that right? 17 A Correct. 18 Q All right. What crops or agricultural 19 activities do you engage in? 20 A Corn, beans, wheat, hay, cattle. 21 Q No further questions. Thank you. Oh, one 22 last question. 23 A Sure. 24 Q Let me come back. I think Mr. Row said the 25 concerns were, I believe, topsoil removal, erosion, 485 1 and property value decreasing. Are those the primary 2 concerns of the township trustees? 3 A Yes, those are some of the concerns. I 4 mean, property values will drop. I know the extra 5 money supposedly that Open Roads will be putting into 6 the community from their tax has to be substantial to 7 make up for the loss of the property values that it's 8 going to devalue. So I don't know whether it's going 9 to be a wash. It might be a wash in year five, but in 10 year 20, we might be losing money because it's a set 11 amount for the entire project. 12 Q And so erosion, topsoil laws, property 13 values decreasing, any other concerns? 14 A The roads, because that report, I kind of -- 15 I've dealt with ABD [ph], like Jason said. That 16 report is guidelines. I look at that as, like, a 17 speed limit sign and no littering sign. You can 18 either obey it or you don't. And in my experience 19 dealing with it, they did not obey what they were 20 supposed to do. And they didn't do it in some of 21 these other projects too. So there is history to 22 support that. 23 Q So you're concerned about compliance with 24 the conditions? 25 A Absolutely. Because I don't think it'll 486 1 happen. Because their number one goal is to get the 2 job done, because I've experienced this. Get the job 3 done. We'll take the chance. The risk is worth the 4 reward. If we get it done quicker, if we don't get 5 caught, we won't get fined or penalized. 6 Q And do you know that the Power Siting Board 7 has a compliance team that monitors projects and 8 construction as well as operation? 9 A Yes, they do. They don't do it exactly. If 10 we have a problem today, and they're there in three 11 days, they might not to see that problem. 12 Q But you know they're available as a resource 13 if the project's approved for them? 14 A Pardon me? 15 Q They're available as a resource for the 16 township if the project's approved, right? 17 A Yes. We tried to get the EPA out for 18 another problem in the township. That was probably 19 five years ago, they still don't come out. So you 20 have to get them to show up first. 21 MR. SETTINERI: No further questions. 22 Thank you. 23 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 24 Thank you for your testimony. 25 Next witness is Mary Bebout. 487 1 Please raise your right hand. Do you 2 swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to 3 provide is the truth? 4 MS. BEBOUT: Yes, I do. 5 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 6 your name for the record. 7 THE WITNESS: Mary Bebout, and Mary, 8 M-A-R-Y, Bebout, B-E-B-O-U-T. 9 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, as well 10 as township? 11 THE WITNESS: 15893 Vance Road, Mount 12 Vernon, Ohio. 13 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 14 the project area? 15 THE WITNESS: It's just up the road. 16 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 17 intervening party? 18 THE WITNESS: No. 19 JUDGE ASTA: Please proceed. 20 DIRECT STATEMENT 21 THE WITNESS: Okay. I would like to 22 state that I'm opposed to the Frasier Solar Project 23 slated for Miller and Clinton Township. I am totally 24 against all the agricultural ground being taken up 25 with the project. 488 1 I come from a long line of farmers. 2 And I don't care what their views or data say, you 3 cannot replace topsoil, the life and blood of the 4 plant overnight. It takes years and years to rebuild 5 it, and it can't be done at all -- if it could be done 6 at all. This ground, contrary to what they say, is 7 ruined for farming in the future. 8 I also wonder if people have thought 9 about what would happen if China or other countries 10 buy these solar fields. They then control our power 11 supply. This would put the United States in a very 12 difficult situation. It was in the news the other day 13 that President Biden is not replenishing our reserve 14 petroleum supply, which again means we could be in 15 trouble down the road. 16 We have lost hundreds and hundreds of 17 acres of farm ground each and every year. We cannot 18 withstand this continually, year after year, and feed 19 our people. We farmers and growers are faced with 20 government restrictions on what we can use to produce 21 our product, all the while trying to maintain or 22 improve our production level. 23 Last year, the US imported more food 24 than ever and who knows what conditions they were 25 raised under. The consumer is wanting to know more 489 1 and more how their food is being raised, and they like 2 to buy locally produced products. 3 Again, if all the big companies like 4 Intel -- or Intel, Amazon, and all these coming to 5 Ohio, why don't they -- taking up our farm ground, 6 then why aren't they mandated to install solar panels 7 on their roofs, parking lots, and stop double dipping 8 on our productive farm ground? 9 However, I believe they know it is not 10 a profitable or safe project, and they don't want to 11 do it, which leads to the theory that these solar 12 fields are not profitable. They seem to be sold 13 multiple times, and if there's money makers, then why 14 are they being sold over and over again? 15 I believe the United States can come up 16 with a better way to produce electricity in the 17 future. Europe has come up with a nuclear fusion that 18 brings the world a step closer to the dream of 19 limitless, clean power. I believe we can match that 20 or come up with something even better without gobbling 21 up farm ground. 22 On the way up here this morning, or 23 tonight, I was thinking, take your simple breakfast. 24 Eggs, bacon, toast. It took a farmer, a wheat farmer, 25 to grow that wheat. It took people to grind it. It 490 1 took people to package and sell it. There's a lot of 2 people put to work. 3 Take your eggs. It took a poultry 4 farmer to raise the chickens. It took feed to make 5 that chicken grow. There again, you got grain. Farm 6 production. Bacon. We all know that comes from a 7 hog, and it took a hog farmer to raise it, care for 8 it, nurture it. There again, you've got grain going 9 into it that some farmer had to grow. 10 Just a simple thing like that, toast, 11 bread. Took a wheat farmer. To put butter on it, you 12 have a dairy farmer, you put jam on it. Lady behind 13 me was talking tonight about strawberries she's 14 growing. If she's going to put freezer jam up, she's 15 going to have to use a bunch of sugar there again, 16 that comes from a farmer. Farmers are included in 17 everything. If you're wearing cotton underwear, you 18 had to be a cotton farmer somewhere. Farmers are in 19 everything we use. 20 So in closing, I'd just like to say, we 21 are a small part of this world, but we need to take 22 care of it wisely. And I don't feel this is a good 23 investment. Thank you. 24 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 25 Any questions? 491 1 No questions. Thank you, ma'am. 2 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 3 JUDGE ASTA: Next witness is Juliet 4 Strinka. 5 Please raise your right hand. Do you 6 swear affirm that the testimony you're about to 7 provide is the truth. 8 MS. STRINKA: I do. 9 JUDGE ASTA: And please state and spell 10 your name for the record. 11 THE WITNESS: Okay. It's Juliet 12 Strinka, with an R. 13 JUDGE ASTA: My apologies. 14 THE WITNESS: It's okay. We get it a 15 lot. It's J-U-L-I-E-T S-T-R-I-N-K-A. 16 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, as well 17 as township? 18 THE WITNESS: Sure. It's 3879 Weaver 19 Road, and that's in Mount Vernon. That's Miller 20 Township. 21 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 22 the project area? 23 THE WITNESS: Yes. I live down the 24 road, and I also work from home. 25 JUDGE ASTA: Okay. And are you a 492 1 member of an intervening party? 2 THE WITNESS: I am not. 3 JUDGE ASTA: Please proceed. 4 DIRECT STATEMENT 5 THE WITNESS: Okay. I'm going to set 6 my timer just so I know where I'm at in the five 7 minutes. 8 I oppose the Frasier Solar Project. Do 9 you have a place that is special to you? In our 10 family, we call it a thin place, a location where the 11 distance between Earth and Heaven seems thinner than 12 other places. 13 When we were newly married, my husband 14 took a job nearby. We had never been to Mount Vernon, 15 so I drove in via 661, and when I came over the hill 16 and caught that expansive view of the valley, where 17 Mount Vernon stretches before you, I had the 18 instinctual sense that this was home. It was a thin 19 place experience. That singular view shaped our 20 entire future. We started a family and became rooted 21 in this vibrant community. 22 During a particularly difficult season, 23 I experienced pregnancy loss and debilitating 24 postpartum depression. I would take long country 25 drives to clear my mind -- sorry, I didn't expect to 493 1 get emotional. I kid you not, my route was Rangeline 2 Road to Sycamore Road, looping back on 661 to catch 3 that same feeling of awe and peace. This was before 4 this project and these people were over here. Those 5 scenic drives helped me survive the heartbreak of the 6 human experience. 7 Soon after, a small farmhouse came up 8 for sale right in the heart of that thin place. Our 9 humble American dream finally achieved, despite so 10 many ups and downs. So do you have your own thin 11 place? I ask you to imagine it right now. How would 12 you react if a developer was given unfettered access 13 to set up a power plant there? Even though your 14 community had done everything in its power to protect 15 it. 16 I share this personal story because I 17 want you to remember that we are whole people whose 18 lives are in the balance. Your decision affects not 19 just finances in the viewshed, but living, breathing 20 human beings who are just trying to protect our home. 21 I have a list of studies that proves 22 the benefits of nature on mental health. Our nation 23 is facing a mental health crisis and the resulting 24 substance abuse epidemic. Living in the country, 25 outside the influence of light and sound pollution 494 1 resets the central nervous system and circadian 2 rhythms and disarms the fight-or-flight response. 3 Humans are designed to thrive in harmony with nature. 4 The Frasier Project threatens our mental and physical 5 health. 6 Miller Township created its zoning in 7 1983. It reads, "This resolution is enacted for the 8 purpose of public health, safety, morals, comfort, and 9 general welfare to conserve and protect property and 10 property values, to secure the appropriate use of land 11 all in accordance with a comprehensive plan for the 12 desirable future development of Miller Township, all 13 as authorized by the Ohio Revised Code." 14 Before we purchased our home, I looked 15 this up, and I was reassured that I would be able to 16 live life undisturbed by urbanization and 17 industrialization. We hadn't even unpacked the moving 18 boxes when I received a mailer informing me of the 19 Frasier Solar Project. I was naþve to think that 20 local laws held any authority in the state of Ohio. I 21 have a right to the way of life that I have earned. 22 The phrase "property rights" has been 23 thrown around so much, I don't think people know what 24 it means. Property rights does not mean you can do 25 whatever you want with your land. We live in a 495 1 republic where the people decide the future of their 2 communities. Ohio Revised Code Section 713 affirms 3 this. Zoning protects everyone's property against 4 state and government overreach. 5 Zoning protects my hard-won property 6 value by keeping my neighbor in check. Regardless of 7 economic status, acres owned, race or gender, in our 8 great nation, one person gets one vote. The state is 9 undermining the voting rights of vulnerable 10 populations such as women and lower income families by 11 taking these projects off the ballot, elevating them 12 above local zoning and handing the destiny of 13 working-class neighborhoods to wealthy land barons and 14 out-of-state corporations. It's as if we're in a 15 feudal system where the big fancy landowner has more 16 say in the community than the simple mother next door. 17 It's 2024 and local zoning regulations 18 give me an equal say in my community. The state of 19 Ohio agrees with me. That's what Senate Bill 52 is 20 all about. You have ample evidence that our county 21 and townships don't want this. It would be unethical 22 to contradict the intent of Senate Bill 52 and approve 23 this project because of a technicality. 24 Finally, yes, I read the staff report. 25 You don't need studies. You have an auditorium of 496 1 experts right here, and these generational farmers are 2 living vessels of generations of wisdom and knowledge 3 about this land. Thank you. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Please refrain from 5 applause. 6 Any questions? 7 MR. SETTINERI: No questions. 8 JUDGE ASTA: Okay. Thank you. 9 And next witness is DJ Peters. 10 Do you swear or affirm that the 11 testimony you're about to provide is the truth? 12 MR. PETERS: I do. 13 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 14 your name for the record. 15 THE WITNESS: It's actually Daniel 16 Peters. It's D-A-N-I-E-L P-E-T-E-R-S. 17 JUDGE ASTA: My apologies. 18 THE WITNESS: That's okay. 19 JUDGE ASTA: Please state your address, 20 including township. 21 THE WITNESS: It's 7127 Columbus Road, 22 Centerburg, Ohio, and that's Liberty Township. 23 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 24 the project area? 25 THE WITNESS: Not in it, but near it. 497 1 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 2 party? 3 THE WITNESS: No, I'm not. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 5 DIRECT STATEMENT 6 THE WITNESS: Thank you. So I don't 7 have a big lengthy statement, speech, and everything, 8 but what I do have is I have myself, my opinion, and 9 what I see a lot of other people sharing, showing. 10 I've read a lot of things. I've seen a lot of things. 11 I just don't understand where the cons are not 12 weighing out the pros. 13 When you sit there and you look at, you 14 know, you got multiple things of conception rates 15 dropping, the topsoil issue, the runoff, all of that 16 stuff. So it's kind of like when you hire somebody at 17 a fast food restaurant, you expect every employee to 18 do their job. How many times have you went to Wendy's 19 and not got your order right? Even though it's that 20 small, that still spans into other corporations and 21 stuff like that, because, yeah, they can say they're 22 going to hold every employee accountable and all of 23 this and everything else. 24 These guys are in it for the money. 25 That's all they want, money and gone. We're all going 498 1 to be left stuck with every single bit of it. I have 2 an almost 13-year-old son and a 10-year-old daughter. 3 I'm looking out for them because, as of right now, 4 you've taken away all the right for all of us to vote. 5 This should be a voting matter. This shouldn't be 6 what a group of people decide for the rest of 7 everybody. 8 I know that you guys have been selected 9 and stuff like that, but I really feel that it should 10 be put on a ballot for only the people in the county 11 and the surrounding area. They shouldn't be allowed 12 to be going to Lincoln County and guys coming out of 13 Marion and all that stuff. I understand where people 14 are trying to, you know, better the -- better the 15 future and stuff like that. But there's a lot of 16 other ways to do it. 17 The property rights things, all of that 18 got messed with the zoning. You can't just go out and 19 build what you want. Your property rights got taken 20 away right then and there. You can't go build a 21 Flying J without getting it permitted and everything 22 else. 23 You know, you're going to be bringing 24 in all kinds of other people from all these other 25 places that care about their homes in the way that 499 1 they want and the way that they like them. But they 2 come here, and I've worked with all kinds of different 3 men throughout my years are working in places and 4 stuff. And those guys don't care when they're at 5 those places because that's not their home. They care 6 at home but not there. 7 So, you know, they leave trash, they 8 tear up the property. I don't know if you've heard 9 about the crime rate and stuff like that. But a lot 10 of these guys are going to come down here and commit 11 crimes. You know, half of it's not going to be taken 12 into consideration because they're not from here. 13 So unless it gets picked up and stuff 14 like that, I just don't understand where there's even 15 a question on where the cons aren't, you know, they're 16 worse than the pros. I don't see enough backing it up 17 to really make it worthwhile. But that's about it. 18 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 19 MR. PETERS: Thank you. 20 JUDGE ASTA: Any questions for this 21 witness? 22 Thank you for your testimony. 23 Next is Mike Miller. 24 Please raise your hand. Do you swear 25 or affirm that the testimony you're about to provide 500 1 is the truth? 2 MR. MILLER: I do. 3 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 4 your name for the records. 5 THE WITNESS: Michael Miller, 6 M-I-C-H-A-E-L M-I-L-L-E-R. 7 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, as well 8 as township? 9 THE WITNESS: 304 Oak Street, Mount 10 Vernon, Ohio. 11 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 12 the project area? 13 THE WITNESS: No. 14 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 15 intervening party? 16 THE WITNESS: No. 17 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 18 DIRECT STATEMENT 19 THE WITNESS: Okay, thanks. Hello, my 20 name is Mike Miller, and currently I represent Mount 21 Vernon City Council, Ward 4, as councilman. 22 Prior to this position, I retired from 23 the Ohio Department of Natural Resources with 35 years 24 in natural resources. I have worked in Knox County 25 since 1994 as a wildlife officer, and in the field, 501 1 retired after completing public service as chief of 2 the Ohio Division of Wildlife and Watercraft. I 3 worked with the OPSB for a time with wind energy, 4 particularly the Icebreaker. So I have a general 5 understanding of how these projects go and what 6 happens behind the scenes down in Columbus. 7 The Mount Vernon City Council has 8 passed a unanimous resolution not in favor of the 9 Frasier Solar Development. The townships that the 10 project is planned for have also passed resolutions 11 not in favor of the project. There are 22 townships 12 in the county, 18 have passed resolutions against the 13 project, including one resolution from the city of 14 Mount Vernon. Most of the county is against this 15 project. 16 Frasier Solar is not in compliance with 17 the Ohio Department of Natural Resources guidance for 18 proposed solar energy facilities in Ohio, updated 19 4/7/22. The project may not be in compliance with the 20 Ohio EPA guidance on post-construction stormwater 21 management for solar fields. This project will 22 displace existing wildlife resources onto adjacent 23 lands, not in the project area, and could cause 24 additive mortality to migratory birds. 25 Knox County is still in a unique 502 1 position, I feel. We have no large solar developments 2 in the county. The wishes of the county, townships, 3 and city should be followed. As a collective, we are 4 the elected officials representing the best wishes of 5 our community. 6 And in the end, I have attachments 7 including the Mount Vernon City Resolution, the ODNR 8 Solar Guidelines, and the Ohio EPA guidance for the 9 stormwater runoff. So I've also submitted those 10 online, and that's it. Keep it short, sweet, to the 11 point. 12 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 13 Any questions? 14 CROSS-EXAMINATION 15 BY MR. SETTINERI: 16 Q Good evening, Mr. Miller. 17 A Hello. 18 Q It's nice to hear that you've done some work 19 with the Power Siting Board in the past. 20 A Yes. 21 Q I'm Mike Settineri, on behalf of Frasier 22 Solar. Now, you are aware that the director of the 23 Ohio EPA, the director of the Ohio Department of 24 Natural Resources are board members, correct? 25 A Yes. 503 1 Q Okay. And you're also aware when an 2 application filed at the OPSB that the member 3 agencies, including ODNR and OPA, review that 4 application and provide input to the staff report, 5 right? 6 A They do. 7 Q And did you do that in regard to the 8 Icebreaker Project? 9 A I did. 10 Q Okay. And that project was ultimately 11 approved, correct? 12 A It was. 13 Q Okay. 14 A Not while was there. I understand what 15 happens in Columbus. 16 Q In regards to the Frasier Solar Project, 17 just to clarify the record, you mentioned, I think, 18 18 townships passed resolutions against the project. 19 A Yeah. 20 Q Am I right those -- the number of townships, 21 could be maybe 18, passed resolutions requesting the 22 county do an exclusion zones for their areas, right? 23 A Right. 24 Q So it wasn't directly against the project, 25 right? 504 1 A It's overall solar. 2 Q Okay. 3 A But I think we don't have any other projects 4 in the county actively going right now because -- the 5 one thing I'm curious about, I've heard and I thought 6 I read it somewhere, additional maybe four projects in 7 the thought process or design of other companies for 8 the county. That's why I thought that we currently 9 don't have any of the county, so -- 10 Q Now that the -- you said that a resolution 11 was passed by the city. Is that Resolution -- 12 A Yes. 13 Q -- that's 31? 14 A It is Resolution 2024-31, yes, sir. 15 Q Passed March 11, 2024, right? 16 A Yes, I think so. 17 Q Okay. Now this was before the staff report 18 issued in this case, right? 19 A The staff report? Which one? 20 Q Staff report recommendation. 21 A I -- what I read -- I haven't read anything 22 before, before this is what I read online on the Power 23 Siting Board -- Siting Board, sorry. I haven't read 24 anything since then, online. So as far as the date of 25 what they have recommended, I have not read that. 505 1 Q Okay. And you're aware that the OPSB staff 2 issues a report and recommendation? 3 A Yes, they make recommendations. 4 Q Okay. Have you read that report and 5 recommendation for this project? 6 A It came out after we passed the resolution, 7 no, I have not yet. 8 Q Okay, all right. And the resolution was 9 passed on an emergency basis, right? 10 A Yes. In Mount Vernon, we generally pass 11 everything on an emergency basis. 12 Q Now, but there was a vote no on the 13 resolution by Mr. Ruckman, right? 14 A For the initial yes, but at the end, when we 15 actually passed the resolution, it was a unanimous 16 resolution. 17 Q Okay. But he also explained, it's a hearing 18 resolution, actually in the second page, that he 19 thought more discussion on the legislation was needed 20 and criticized the tone of the public's debate on the 21 issue. Did you see that? 22 A Yeah, I was there. I remember him voting no 23 when we were discussing whether to do the resolution. 24 And then we went through that, he did vote no, but 25 then after that he voted yes in this final resolution. 506 1 Q May I see the resolution? 2 A Yeah. I would like to hope that you have 3 the same one I have. That looks a little different 4 maybe it's because of the print, how you printed it 5 off. 6 Q That's the final resolution? 7 A Yeah, this is what I got off from Todd, our 8 clerk. Matt Starr signed it. Yeah. 9 Q This is at the front page said 2024-31, mine 10 also says 2024-31. 11 A Yep. This was taken from directly that 12 night, when we signed it. Yours looks slightly 13 different. I don't know where you printed that off 14 at, maybe. 15 Q I can represent it was off the city's 16 website. 17 A Okay. 18 Q All right. Well, let me ask this. Did you 19 have any meetings with a Frasier Solar representative 20 prior to the vote on the resolution yourself? 21 A The night of, someone came, was it you that 22 came, I think? That night talked, that night. Before 23 that, we had no conversation on behalf of the city 24 council. No one came to spoke to council about the 25 project that I'm aware of. It actually made many city 507 1 council members upset, that no one bothered to talk to 2 city council, which are the elected representatives of 3 each ward in the city. 4 Q Now, you were at the planning and zoning 5 commission meeting when a draft resolution -- 6 A No. I was not at that hearing. 7 Q All right. 8 A Mike Hillier was there. I think he spoke 9 the last time. I replaced him on city council. 10 Q Okay. And you're aware that -- when did you 11 become aware of the project yourself? 12 A Actually, I found out about it when a couple 13 other city council people told me about it. I mean, I 14 knew it was in the city then. I knew of the entire 15 project, and I looked at it, and I read it. I read 16 about the project. I collected information from 17 Frasier. I read what I could read online. I read 18 what I read in Mount Vernon News. 19 Q But when did that happen? When did you find 20 out about the project? 21 A I don't know, eight months, nine months, a 22 year ago? I mean, I wasn't on council then. I was a 23 community member. 24 Q Okay. When did you get elected to council? 25 A I just started this year, on January 1. 508 1 Q Okay. Congratulations. 2 A Thank you. 3 Q And then you said -- you also mentioned you 4 collected information from Frasier Solar. So that was 5 prior to you joining city council? 6 A Yeah, prior to council. I read all their 7 information that they had put out from their office, 8 and I even picked it up, I think, on the first Friday, 9 or one of the displays they had here locally in town. 10 And then I read what they had online. But I can say 11 this, I'm not against solar as long as it's on a 12 rooftop in a parking lot in a brownfield. That's what 13 -- I think agricultural land should be taken as a last 14 best use. 15 I think that personally, and as city council 16 voted, that solar development projects such as this 17 are not the last best use. And I also feel that they 18 should go through zoning. And I believe there's also 19 stormwater issues. I talked to our city engineering 20 office and their engineers, and that was before this 21 vote even, and they advised me that there's all kinds 22 of red flags with zoning issue -- with not zoning, but 23 with stormwater runoff. 24 And from what I read the other day Mr. 25 Clendening had the same issue. Sorry, I know we're 509 1 talking. Sorry. 2 Q Yep -- 3 A I can talk forever. 4 MR. SETTINERI: No further questions. 5 Thank you. Congratulations again. 6 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. Next is Derek 7 Posey. 8 Hearing none, Jill Haupt [ph]. Oh, 9 never mind, sorry, my apologies. 10 MR. POSEY: No problem. 11 JUDGE ASTA: Please raise your right 12 hand. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony 13 you're about to provide is the truth? 14 MR. POSEY: I do. 15 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 16 your name for the record. 17 THE WITNESS: Derek Posey, D-E-R-E-K 18 P-O-S-E-Y. 19 JUDGE ASTA: And your address, 20 including township, please? 21 THE WITNESS: 3475 Rangeline Road in 22 Mount Vernon, Ohio. That's Miller Township. 23 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 24 the project area? 25 THE WITNESS: I do, about a mile away. 510 1 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of an 2 intervening party? 3 THE WITNESS: I'm not. 4 JUDGE ASTA: Please proceed. 5 DIRECT STATEMENT 6 THE WITNESS: Thank you. First of all, 7 thank you for your time. It's been a long, what, 8 three nights now, and we appreciate the extension the 9 board's given us in providing everybody the 10 opportunity to speak. It's been a long few weeks, and 11 really just appreciate your time in being able to 12 express our opinion and actually taking the time to 13 hear from the community that lives within the project 14 areas. 15 Before we get started, just wanted to 16 talk about a few things in terms of the connotation 17 and just the entire process of this is a bunch of 18 unknowns, okay? It's assumptions. It's we don't 19 know. We think. We're not really sure how this might 20 work out, you know, just the connotation of in the 21 talking about after the project. 22 If we're going to remove the project, 23 if we're going to restore the ground, why are we doing 24 it in the first place? Doesn't really make any sense. 25 So if we're already making plans to remove the project 511 1 and restore the property after the fact, it's probably 2 a red flag that this is not a good idea and not a 3 sustainable project. 4 So around that connotation, let's talk 5 about some facts, no opinions. So let's talk about 6 sunlight in Ohio. Just some basic research. You can 7 go online and you're going to see a lot of common 8 facts when you look up Ohio and sunlight. Ohio 9 typically ranks on average 38 out of the 50 states and 10 could rank as low as 44 out of 50 in a year. Probably 11 not good for a solar project. 12 Average annual sunlight hours, 2,100 13 hours, clear days, on average there's 72 clear days in 14 Ohio. That's around 19.7 percent of the year. Summer 15 peaks sun hours, 5.26 hours per day. In winter, peak 16 sun hours, 2.66 hours per day. Clearly, Ohio is not a 17 sunshine state. It really doesn't make sense when you 18 start to break down the data, and you look at the 19 power source, and you look at just the facts, what are 20 we doing? 21 Some other concerns that we have. The 22 unknown impact on the health of our children, 23 neighbors, and surrounding environments. If you all 24 had the option, you're sitting on the stage today, and 25 gentlemen down here, if you had the option to have 512 1 your home beside a solar project or a power plant, 2 would you do it? Probably not. 3 Do you want your children running 4 around a solar project that's a mile away, ten feet 5 away? It doesn't matter. There's a lot of neighbors 6 here that are really close, closer than I am. I've 7 got a concern. I couldn't imagine being -- having 8 that in my backyard. 9 So, health concerns, the displacement 10 of agriculture, I think that's been hit pretty hard 11 here today. And also just limited data on putting 12 that agricultural land back in place, but I honestly 13 just can't wrap my head around. And you've matched 14 the numbers up, and you talk about reverting it back 15 to farm ground later. What are we even going down 16 this avenue for? 17 And then just another piece of this, 18 when we talk about property rights, all for property 19 rights. I think it makes total sense, right? I have 20 property rights. This could potentially drive my 21 property right -- my property value down, and that's 22 not good for me. I understand that there's 23 opportunities for these other landowners, but at the 24 same time, we've talked about zoning. 25 I can't just build a barn on my 513 1 property with three apartments in the top of it and 2 have people living in it and making money. I can't 3 produce income for myself. But down the road, it's 4 okay to do this on this scale and affect every single 5 person in our community just so one person can make 6 money. How's that equal opportunity? It makes no 7 sense. 8 We actually have someone within our 9 township that know of this, he built a nice garage 10 with his own money, bought his own property. It's his 11 property, right? He put a garage in. He's got an 12 apartment up top for him to potentially just stay in 13 on the weekends. He's not even renting it out. 14 Because of zoning laws, he's not really supposed to be 15 living in that dwelling. But it's okay for someone 16 else to put all of this in and affect an entire 17 township, an entire county, and drive everyone else's 18 property values down, and there's already zoning laws 19 in place so that doesn't happen. 20 So we're kind of making an exception 21 for this project, and I don't think that makes any 22 sense. And in terms of just wrapping this up, I hope 23 that you all just take the opinions of the people that 24 live within the project area. It's pretty clear that 25 if you guys fail here today, that the Kenyon area -- 514 1 it's -- they're all for it. So if you guys want to 2 cancel this and move it up that way, that's fine. 3 I understand that's far away from New 4 Albany, but you guys can do it up there in the Kenyon 5 area if you really want to. And I'm not trying to try 6 to be smart about it, I'm just telling you, like, when 7 you guys take into the account the opinions of the 8 people, the only ones that matter are the ones that 9 are going to have to deal with this for the next 30 10 years and have to deal with all the repercussions of 11 these decisions that you all make. 12 So I just hope that you take the 13 opinion of the people that live in these communities. 14 That's really all that matters at the end of the day. 15 Not people living in Columbus, not the people from 16 Kenyon. So thank you for your time. 17 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 18 Any questions for this witness? 19 MR. SETTINERI: No questions. 20 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 21 Next is Jill Haupt [ph]. Hearing none, 22 John Rosseau [ph]. Hearing none, Cody Beacom [ph]. 23 Hearing none, John W. Johnson. Hearing none, Sarah 24 Laughlin [ph]. Hearing none, Greg Culbertson 25 contacted OPSB and informed us that he is not 515 1 testifying tonight. Craig S. Colopy. 2 Please raise your right hand. Do you 3 swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to 4 provide is the truth? 5 MR. COLOPY: I do. 6 JUDGE ASTA: Please state and spell 7 your name for the record. 8 THE WITNESS: My name is Craig S. 9 Colopy. I live at 300 Kimberly Drive in Fourth Ward, 10 City of Mount Vernon. 11 JUDGE ASTA: And do you live or work in 12 the project area? 13 THE WITNESS: No, I do not. 14 JUDGE ASTA: And are you a member of 15 any intervening party? 16 THE WITNESS: No, I am not. 17 JUDGE ASTA: Please continue. 18 DIRECT STATEMENT 19 THE WITNESS: First, thank you for 20 taking the opportunity to allow me to speak tonight. 21 To tell you a little bit about myself, 22 I'm a former and retired Knox County Health Inspector, 23 i.e. sanitarium, from 1986 to 1991. Then I furthered 24 my career with the City of Columbus Department of 25 Health from 1991 to 2001. And then switched over to 516 1 the City of Columbus Department of Public Safety 2 license section, in which I regulated 32 different 3 licenses for the City of Columbus, including the Chief 4 Enforcement Officer for the Board of Charitable 5 Solicitations. 6 I'm here tonight to oppose the Frasier 7 Solar Project that will be in Clinton and Miller 8 Township. It's interesting when you look at the 9 United States Department of Energy, they have some 10 interesting facts about sunlight and also about how it 11 reflects with the solar panels. It states that light 12 either gets reflected or turned into heat, instead of 13 getting the electric efficiency. 14 We always talk about Europe and the 15 things that go on in Europe. Half of the countries in 16 Europe use solar power -- use nuclear power. 13 out 17 of 27 countries with France, Germany, Spain, Sweden, 18 and Belgium leading the way with nuclear power. 19 Nuclear power is more efficient than solar. 20 Why are we taking highly productive 21 farm fields and turning them into solar fields, when 22 we have just let in the United States ten million 23 people and counting? These people will need to be 24 "feeded." There is a bigger situation going on than 25 just with solar. 517 1 This is solar, but it's taking farmland 2 from the likes of, like, Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, 3 and China. If you lack -- if you look at what 4 happened in Madison County, Ohio, where there were 5 6,000 acres of very productive farmland, which was 6 approved by this board. My opinion, the reason that 7 that was approved by this board was because this had 8 involvement with Bill Gates. 9 These solar fields should be placed in 10 old landfills, not on rich farmland to use to be 11 fed -- help us feed our people. Productive farmland 12 in the Midwest, which is being destroyed by wealthy 13 people acquiring this farmland to change with 14 different foods, with the federal government and state 15 government incentives, and by some of our local 16 officials who have failed to do largely what the 17 people of this county want. 18 To our county officials, this issue 19 should have never gotten this far. This issue should 20 have been brought to a ballot issue where all of Knox 21 County could either vote for or against the use of 22 solar. Do we really think that communities like New 23 Albany, Dublin, Hilliard, Upper Arlington, Grandview 24 Heights, Mason, Kings Mills, Lakewood, and the suburb 25 of Cleveland, Strongsville, Huber Heights, Wayne, 518 1 Centerville would allow something like this to be put 2 in their communities? Hell no. 3 If this is going to be approved by the 4 body, by you folks, I would urge that the concerned 5 citizens ask that they go further by either local 6 means or by the Ohio Supreme Court. Thank you. 7 JUDGE ASTA: Thank you. 8 Any questions for this witness? 9 Thank you for your testimony. 10 Next witness is Amber Keener [ph]. 11 Hearing none, Sarah Wallace [ph]. Hearing none, I 12 will hand it over to ALJ David Hicks. 13 JUDGE HICKS: We've been going now for 14 about two hours solid, so we are going to take a break 15 right now. 16 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER 3: There's sheets 17 out here. 18 JUDGE HICKS: Sure. There's sheets out 19 there, anyone who has to go talk to our staff out 20 there to sign, and they can they can help you with 21 that. But we are going to take a ten-minute break. 22 It's 6:50 right now. We will look to come back on at 23 about seven o'clock. With that, we are off the 24 record. 25 THE REPORTER: We are off the record at 519 1 6:51 p.m. 2 (Off the record.) 3 JUDGE HICKS: We are going to go ahead 4 and go back on the record, folks, can go ahead and 5 file in. I'm going to turn it over to my colleague, 6 Judge Sandor, here, and we are going to keep calling 7 the witnesses in order. 8 JUDGE SANDORS: All right, the last 9 one -- 10 THE OFFICER: Sorry, I turned it on. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. The last 12 remaining group of witnesses are, I believe, 13 intervenors. And we'll clarify that with them when 14 they come up here to testify. 15 The first up is Beth Bartley. 16 MS. BARTLEY: Hi, Jason [ph]. 17 JUDGE SANDOR: Before we get started, I 18 want to clarify your counsel, is it Mr. Van Kley? 19 MS. BARTLEY: Yes. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. You are aware 21 that he is not present tonight? 22 MS. BARTLEY: No, I didn't know that, 23 but I don't know that it matters. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. So he's not 25 present, and if you're choosing to testify, you 520 1 acknowledge that you're choosing to testify tonight 2 without your counsel present. 3 MS. BARTLEY: Okay. 4 MR. SETTINERI: Your Honor -- 5 MS. BARTLEY: I've been here three 6 times, so -- 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, one moment. 8 MR. SETTINERI: Let's go off the 9 record. Can I have a discussion with the bench? 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Let's go off the record. 11 THE REPORTER: All right. We're going 12 to go off the record at 7:06 p.m. 13 (Off the record.) 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, let's resume. 15 Ms. Bartley, would you please come back 16 up? I'll give you a few statements -- before you 17 start answering, I'll give you a few statements, and 18 you can say whether you agree or not before we proceed 19 with your testimony. 20 MS. BARTLEY: Okay. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: So, first, you are aware 22 that you're represented by counsel in this case, and 23 he's not present tonight? 24 MS. BARTLEY: Yes. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Do you 521 1 acknowledge that you're choosing to testify tonight 2 without your counsel present, meaning you are subject 3 to cross-examination -- 4 MS. BARTLEY: Yes. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: -- by opposing counsel 6 without your attorney present? 7 MS. BARTLEY: Yes. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And then, two, in 9 the alternative, you may choose to come to the 10 evidentiary hearing that begins on August 19, 2022, 11 where your counsel will be present, in lieu of giving 12 testimony tonight. 13 MS. BARTLEY: No, thank you. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Please raise your 15 right hand. Do you swear to tell the whole truth? 16 MS. BARTLEY: Yep. 17 JUDGE SANDOR: And can you please state 18 your name for the record. 19 THE WITNESS: Beth Bartley, B-E-T-H 20 B-A-R-T-L-E-Y. 19026 Arrington Road, Utica, Morgan 21 Township. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Do you work 23 or reside within the project area? 24 THE WITNESS: Yes. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Which one? 522 1 THE WITNESS: I own ground that's right 2 beside it. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. And you are 4 an interviewer, correct? 5 THE WITNESS: Yes. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please 7 proceed. 8 DIRECT STATEMENT 9 THE WITNESS: I oppose the Solar 10 Frasier Project or the Frasier Solar Project. I did 11 take this oath seriously, and I hope that Frasier 12 Solar does too with their honesty to each and every 13 individual the project affects. 14 I have heard people that have testified 15 that they have put solar on their homes, their 16 electric bills dropped. Yay. Good for them. I've 17 also heard one lady tonight that said she did and did 18 not have those same results. 19 When I am farming my ground, I will be 20 right beside the project. I will be picking up the 21 rocks in my field. I will be helping plant it. I 22 will be running the combine when I harvest it, and I 23 will be helping make any repairs to equipment that 24 breaks down in my field. 25 I have a pacemaker. And maybe you can 523 1 answer this, nobody seems to be able to tell me with 2 1,000 percent guarantee that me being in my field, 3 farming my field to make my living will not be 4 affected by the solar panels and the solar farm that 5 is going to be 50 foot away from me. I can't even be 6 10 foot within a welder. I want to guarantee that if 7 this project runs forward it is not going to affect my 8 health and my life. 9 I have crops or covered crops that are 10 flown on by airplane in accordance to the Natural 11 Resources Conservation Service guidelines. I believe 12 the sun reflecting off of those solar panels could 13 possibly affect Brian's [ph] ability to accurately fly 14 on my covered crop, especially within the boundaries 15 of my property lines. 16 Like Mary Bebout said or somebody said 17 about the hail, we had a hailstorm just Friday or 18 whenever it was, and it shredded some of the leaves on 19 my corn. What will that hail do to the solar panels? 20 When Frasier does remove the topsoil to 21 build the product -- their project, it can create 22 uncontrolled runoff of rainwater onto my field, 23 affecting my ability to grow a good, healthy crop by 24 eroding my nutrient rich soil that I have worked very 25 hard over the years to build and sustain. And while 524 1 the leased landowner is making a great amount of money 2 leasing his land, I potentially could be stuck 3 repairing that erosion and rebuilding the health of my 4 soil. 5 The project field has a stream. If 6 there's ever any chemical runoff from the aging panels 7 over the years, it would or could affect the stream, 8 could affect my soil and the stream in my field that 9 runs into the Sycamore Creek. Both of those little 10 streams run into the Sycamore Creek. 11 I believe that technology is constantly 12 state -- changing. I believe solar technology is in 13 its infancy and will be outdated within a few years. 14 I believe whatever is put in now will be outdated 15 within years. Then what happens? 16 I agree with Mary Bebout. Anything 17 that you have relates to farming: Clothes, food, 18 drink, without it you'd be hungry, naked, and sober. 19 That's how I feel. Thank you. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 21 Questions from counsel? 22 MR. SETTINERI: Just a few. 23 CROSS-EXAMINATION 24 BY MR. SETTINERI: 25 Q Good evening, Ms. Bartley. 525 1 A Hello. 2 Q Mike Settineri, on behalf of Frader Solar. 3 You're a member of Preserve Knox County. Is that 4 right? 5 A Yes. 6 Q Okay. When did you join that organization? 7 Do you recall? 8 A A few months ago. Last year. 9 Q All right. Last year? 10 A Whenever it was brought up to me. 11 Q Okay. You reside in Utica, right? Correct? 12 A Yes. 13 Q Okay. But you do own ground in the project 14 area? 15 A Yes. 16 Q And how much acreage do you own in the 17 project area? 18 A 35.183. 19 Q Okay. You also mentioned that you -- I 20 think you said you have covered crops flown by 21 airplane? 22 A Yes. 23 Q What is that? 24 A Well, the mix that I like is barley, crimson 25 clover, and radishes. 526 1 Q Okay. When you said "flown by airplane," 2 what do you mean by that? 3 A An airplane flies and opens it and it 4 spreads it. 5 Q Seed. So you're spreading the seed versus 6 pesticide or herbicides? 7 A Yes. 8 Q Okay. Have you read the staff report and 9 recommendation that was issued in this proceeding by 10 the Power Siting Board staff? 11 A No. 12 Q Okay. Have you read any of the conditions 13 related to the report? 14 A Nope. 15 Q All right. Would you like to receive a copy 16 of that? 17 A Yeah, you can give me one. 18 Q I'll send one to Mr. Van Kley for you. 19 A Okay. 20 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you, Ms. Bartley. 21 No further questions. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Any other 23 questions? 24 Thank you for your testimony. 25 Our next witness is Kari Thomas. 527 1 All right. Let me start off with some 2 questions here, some statements. Are you aware 3 counsel is not present tonight? 4 MS. THOMAS: Yes, I am. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Do you 6 acknowledge that if you do testify tonight that you 7 are subject to cross-examination of that counsel? 8 MS. THOMAS: Yes. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: And then in the 10 alternative, you may choose to come for the 11 evidentiary hearing beginning August 19, 2024, where 12 your counsel will be present. Do you choose to 13 testify tonight or -- 14 MS. THOMAS: I do. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Thank you. 16 Please raise your right hand. Do you swear to tell 17 the truth? 18 MS. THOMAS: I do. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 20 your name for the record. 21 THE WITNESS: Kari Thomas, K-A-R-I 22 T-H-O-M-A-S, 4379 Possum Street, Mount Vernon. We 23 live directly across the road from the project, and 24 I'm an intervenor. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And which 528 1 township is that? 2 THE WITNESS: Miller. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: Miller Township. Okay. 4 All right. Please proceed. 5 DIRECT STATEMENT 6 THE WITNESS: I oppose the proposed 7 Frasier's Industrial Solar Project for Knox County. 8 And I thank you for the opportunity tonight to be 9 heard. My hope tonight is that you not only hear us 10 but that you will listen to us and what we are saying. 11 Most of what I wanted to say has been repeated many 12 times by others who oppose this project. 13 At the previous two hearings, we the 14 people who opposed the project were referred to as 15 uninformed, misinformed, ignorant of facts and even 16 once Marxist. That is an ad hominem, which means -- 17 which is a logical fallacy that is aimed to harm a 18 person's character, rather than the position they are 19 maintaining. 20 We the people who oppose are small 21 business owners, preachers, teachers, authors, and 22 students. We are artisans, retirees, farmers. None 23 of us are Marxist. We the people who oppose are God- 24 fearing, America-loving, tax-paying, law-abiding 25 citizens. We are people who would be directly and 529 1 negatively affected by this project. We are good 2 neighbors without contracts, without -- I'm sorry -- 3 without agreements or payments. We are informed 4 citizens that realize our rights are being 5 jeopardized. 6 There are townships all over this 7 county with zoning regulations put in place 8 specifically to protect the value of property. Not 9 all of us who oppose our eloquent speakers, but it is 10 the passion we feel about this issue that has forced 11 us to get up here and conquer our fears. Please 12 listen to how this project could negatively impact our 13 community. 14 No matter how many taxpayer-funded 15 handouts this company is promising, the overall effect 16 within the life of these solar panels will certainly 17 be negative. None of us wants our rights taken away, 18 and no one wants a neighbor that has to pay you not to 19 complain about them, or one who lowers your property 20 value, or one who puts your health and the health of 21 your family at risk. 22 When we bought our seven-acre mini-farm 23 27 years ago, we expected our -- more homes or hog 24 barns to eventually go up around us in the future, but 25 never did we imagine an industry clear-out on Possum 530 1 Street. There are lawyers who keep busy defending 2 people just like us who oppose industrial solar 3 projects. So this opposition that is here tonight and 4 the previous two hearings is part of a larger and 5 growing group that sees behind the smoke and mirrors 6 and false scientific claims of recycling panels and 7 industrial solar energy production being clean and 8 reliable. 9 The government's Inflation Reduction 10 Act, which really is a green energy bill, funds these 11 projects which in turn pays Chinese firms to mine and 12 extract rare Earth minerals all over the world. How 13 is this green or clean? The overall effect will be 14 that millions of acres of prime farmland all across 15 America will be rendered useless. No matter how many 16 false promises are being made, America will eventually 17 not be the bread basket of the world and we will have 18 food insecurities in a nation that was built on 19 agriculture. 20 We oppose industrial solar. We oppose 21 industrial solar, not solar in general. If someone's 22 faith and hope to save the world that was never 23 created to last forever is in solar by then all means 24 let them put solar panels on their homes and 25 businesses, but don't make everyone else hold to that 531 1 same fate. 2 I have looked at the staff report, and 3 I have some pages -- portions of it to read. Page 34, 4 last paragraph, "38 panels will be located in a 5 floodplain." Page 31, bottom paragraph, "The habitat 6 of four endangered species of bats could be impacted 7 by the project as they anticipate clearing ten acres 8 of trees for construction." 9 Page 49, fourth paragraph, "If all the 10 panels in the project need cleaning, it would require 11 1.3 million gallons of water." Again, is this green? 12 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, Ms. Thomas, that's 13 five minutes. 14 MS. THOMAS: Thank you. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Questions from counsel? 16 CROSS-EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. SETTINERI: 18 Q Good evening, Ms. Thomas, Mike Settineri, on 19 behalf of Frasier Solar. 20 What was that last page number of the staff 21 report you just referenced? 22 A The last one? 23 Q Yeah. 24 A Forty-nine. 25 Q Page 49 of the staff report? 532 1 A Yep. 2 Q And what was that sentence you were reading? 3 A If all the panels in the project need 4 cleaning, it would require 1.3 gallons of water. 5 Q Okay. And that full sentence reads, "In the 6 relatively rare instance in which cleaning of the 7 entire project would be performed, the applicant 8 estimates a maximum of five gallons of water per 9 megawatt hour or 1.3 million gallons total would be 10 used." That's the full sentence, right? 11 A Probably. The whole -- the whole thing is 12 very open. Every time you read something, it's very 13 open. 14 Q Did you review the conditions that staff 15 recommended for the project? 16 A I didn't read the whole thing. 17 Q Okay. Would you be willing to read, at a 18 later time, pages 50, going forward, which lists the 19 general conditions for the project? 20 A I think I have went over that, the 21 conditions. 22 Q And you understand that the board approves 23 the project and adopts staff's recommended conditions, 24 the project would be obligated to follow those 25 recommended conditions, right? 533 1 A I know they want them to. 2 Q Okay. All right. Now, you're a member of 3 Preserve Knox County? 4 A I am. 5 Q And you're an intervenor in the case? 6 A I am. 7 Q When did you join Preserve Knox County? 8 A In the beginning. 9 Q When was the beginning? 10 A Two years ago? Last year. 11 Q What time approximately last year, would you 12 say? Last spring? 13 A Yeah. I guess it was the spring. 14 Q Okay. And how did you join? 15 A Piece of paper. 16 Q Okay. And let me ask this. I'm going to 17 show you a map here, if I may. I'll represent this -- 18 both of the red arrows, that's the page, the 19 navigation -- the natural navigation. Can you 20 identify -- and why don't we go ahead and put the 21 judges as well -- which is marked for this hearing, 22 Frasier Public Hearing, or Frasier PH1. 23 (Frasier Exhibit PH1 was marked for 24 identification.) 25 There we go. The three -- 534 1 JUDGE SANDOR: Excuse me. That's 2 Frasier PH1? 3 MR. SETTINERI: Yeah, I thought that 4 was the best. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. So marked. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. And we can 7 provide copies to the other members here. It's up to 8 Your Honors if you would like copies or not. 9 JUDGE HICKS: I think we're good. 10 MR. SETTINERI: Would you like copies? 11 JUDGE HICKS: No, no. 12 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. All right. 13 BY MR. SETTINERI: 14 Q Ms. Thomas, is that red arrow at the lower 15 left side on both drawings, is that near your 16 property? Is that your property there? 17 A Yes. 18 Q Okay. And are you aware that between June 19 and August of 2023, that panels were -- originally, 20 panels were proposed to be, I believe, right across 21 the road, generally from your property, and that in 22 August, the Frasier Solar moved panels further away 23 from your house. Do you see that? 24 A Yes. 25 Q Okay. And did you have an opportunity to 535 1 meet with any Frasier Solar representatives back in 2 June of 2023? 3 A They were at all of our township meetings. 4 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. All right. All 5 right. No further questions. Thank you. Your Honor, 6 I'd like to put that in the record for this hearing. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. Any 8 objections? Okay, Frasier PH1 is admitted to this 9 hearing. 10 (Frasier Exhibit PH1 was received into 11 evidence) 12 The next witness is Rhonda Noble. You 13 are an intervenor in this case, correct? 14 MS. NOBLE: Yes, I am. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. You're aware that 16 counsel is not present tonight? 17 MS. NOBLE: Yes. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Do you 19 acknowledge that if you testify tonight, that you'll 20 be subject to cross-examination without your counsel 21 present? 22 MS. NOBLE: Yep. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. And in the 24 alternative, you may present your testimony at the 25 August 19, 2024 hearing with your counsel present, if 536 1 you so choose. 2 MS. NOBLE: Correct. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. But you choose to 4 testify tonight? 5 MS. NOBLE: Yep. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please raise 7 your hand. Do you swear to tell the whole truth? 8 MS. NOBLE: I do. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please state 10 your name for the record. 11 THE WITNESS: Rhonda Noble, R-H-O-N-D- 12 A, N-O-B-L-E. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 14 address, including the township. 15 THE WITNESS: 4465 Possum Street, Mount 16 Vernon, Ohio, and that's Miller Township. 17 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 18 reside within the project area? 19 THE WITNESS: I work from home, yes. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And, again, 21 you're an intervenor, correct? 22 THE WITNESS: That is correct. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Please proceed. 24 DIRECT STATEMENT 25 THE WITNESS: On March 27, 2023, I 537 1 received my first letter from Open Roads Renewables 2 saying that there was a solar project coming into 3 Miller Township. This occurred after Open Roads 4 Renewable secretly got a non-disclosure agreement 5 signed from neighbors, so they could lease enough 6 acreage to move the project forward without the 7 community knowledge. They hac been in the area for 8 years, even during the COVID lockdown. As far as I'm 9 concerned, that was unethical and deceptive. 10 With this project being across the road 11 from my home, it's made a very, very long year. The 12 mental anguish of the constant worry and the lack of 13 sleep is almost unbearable. Those of you who do not 14 oppose the project couldn't possibly understand the 15 shock and the strain that I and others have endured. 16 Taxes from the thin film solar panels, page six of the 17 staff report, the water runoffs and wildlife impacts 18 are a huge likelihood. 19 Unlike what the staff report says, page 20 31, the endangered northern harriers are in the 21 project area. They nest and roost across from my home 22 and hunt my land. We also have short-eared owls and 23 most recently a sandhill crane which has visited my 24 pond as witnessed by my neighbors and myself. These 25 creatures, like others, such as the bald eagle, found 538 1 in my vicinity, will greatly be affected before, 2 during and after construction. 3 And, yes, lake effect is a real thing. 4 Page 31 of the staff report says the project is within 5 range of the federally stated -- state endangered 6 northern long-eared bat, the state endangered little 7 brown bat, and the tri-colored bat. And, yet, Open 8 Roads Renewables anticipates approximately ten acres 9 of trees for clearing. Page 33 of the staff report, 10 "With this project, hundreds of acres will be fenced," 11 which is also -- will affect the ecosystem and other 12 wildlife, such as the deer, foxes, and coyotes. 13 The future taxes on our children and 14 grandchildren will be at a record-breaking high. New 15 Treasury Department estimates shows the ten-year cost 16 of eternity -- alternative energy tax credit has gone 17 up 21 fold since 2015 -- since 2015. Increased 18 farmlands are being leased and bought for solar 19 utilities, with Madison County a 6,000-acre solar 20 project, being the latest example here in Ohio. 21 For those who do not understand the 22 impact of solar project, rural America is set to 23 transform by a 55-million-acre federal solar plan and 24 ten million acres of solar collectors. And these 25 were -- the collectors will be needed to help meet the 539 1 US clean energy goals by 2050 and costing taxpayers 2 over 425 billion between now and 2033. 3 A disturbing article from Australia in 4 an Insurance News article says farmers are claiming 5 that they will be uninsurable being close to these 6 projects. How soon will that come to the United 7 States? The possibility of waking up to the 8 unofficial project in our neighborhood without 9 considering our voices or the value of our lives is 10 unacceptable. 11 A 2022 study by Mary McClinton Clay 12 shows that solar projects decrease property values up 13 to 30 percent, and I have that here. While our 14 government has funded, supported and given more rights 15 and resources to the developers, rather than 16 protecting those who work and pay the taxes to have 17 the right to their American dream. The majority of 18 those leasing out their farms don't even live in our 19 township. 20 Our rights are being denied and our 21 rural life and homes destroyed. Those who live in the 22 project area also have property rights and will be 23 detrimentally affected by the project. Page 23 of the 24 staff report says over 2,000 large vehicles will be 25 traveling on our country roads. These vehicles will 540 1 be affecting our livelihood, our rights and 2 obstructing the farmer's rights during planting and 3 harvest seasons. 4 Noise pollution, loss of property 5 values, damaged roads, toxins, wildlife impact, 6 runoffs, flooding, loss of farmland, are real. This 7 is my home, my heritage, my community, and I'm going 8 to protect it against the irrational process 9 instituted by the government. I should not have to 10 worry about a power plant being constructed across the 11 road and the impairment that comes with it. 12 I will protect my property against -- 13 from any assault from Frasier Solar, from the Frasier 14 Solar Project, and the degradation it would have on my 15 rural community and my wildlife. My neighbors, my 16 rural community, and I will fight to preserve safe 17 homes, a secure environment, and community in which we 18 live and to protect our heritage. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: That is five minutes. 20 MS. NOBLE: Thank you. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 22 Any questions, Counsel? 23 CROSS-EXAMINATION 24 BY MR. SETTINERI: 25 Q Good evening, Ms. Noble. 541 1 A Good evening. 2 Q It's nice to meet you. 3 A Very nice to meet you. 4 Q Now, you're a member of Preserve Know 5 County. 6 A Yes, sir, I am. 7 Q When did you join? 8 A Last year. 9 Q Last year? I know in March 27, 2023, you 10 said you got your first letter about the project. 11 A That would be correct. 12 Q Were you involved in the formation of 13 Preserve Knox County? 14 A Not at that point in time, no. 15 Q Okay. Do you know who formed Preserve Knox 16 County? 17 A I believe Gary Koester did, but I did not 18 know him at the time. 19 Q Okay. Are you involved in the organization 20 now? 21 A Yes, I am. 22 Q Do you consider yourselves having a 23 leadership role? 24 A Yes, I am. 25 Q Are you responsible for website content? 542 1 A No, I am not. 2 Q Oh, who's responsible for website content? 3 A Exactly what do you mean website? Like, 4 Preserve Knox County website or Facebook or what are 5 you talking? 6 Q Thank you. I'll back up. Preserve Knox 7 County has a website? 8 A Yes, they do. And, no, I'm not responsible 9 for that. 10 Q Do you know who is responsible? 11 A No, I do not. 12 Q Okay. And have you provided any information 13 to be placed on that website? 14 A No, I have not. 15 Q Now, as an intervenor in this case, your 16 counsel can cross -- articles as a evidentiary, 17 correct? 18 A I don't know. I've never been through 19 something like this. 20 Q Okay, fine. Now, you've read the -- you've 21 obviously read the staff report. Thank you. 22 A Three times, but I still can't remember 23 everything. 24 Q There's a condition -- you're aware there's 25 a condition about sandhill cranes in the staff report? 543 1 A I've read over it, but I'm drawing a blank. 2 Q Condition 52, "Construction in sandhill 3 crane preferred nesting habitat type shall be avoided 4 during the species nesting period, April 1st through 5 August 31." There's additional language there. Does 6 that refresh your recollection about that? 7 A Yes, it does. 8 Q Okay. Does that address your concern about 9 sandhill cranes? 10 A No, it doesn't. I think that what some of 11 that says in there are just words. I have to agree 12 with a gentleman earlier who felt that what people do 13 at their home and what people are going to do at this 14 project are two different things. 15 Q I'm going to do the same thing, I'm going to 16 give you a map as well. We'll mark it as Frasier PH2. 17 (Frasier Exhibit PH2 was marked for 18 identification.) 19 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 20 BY MR. SETTINERI: 21 Q And I'll give that to you -- the red arrow 22 is not the application, but is that red arrow pointing 23 at your residence? 24 A Yes, it is. 25 Q And you were aware that in June of 2023, 544 1 panels were proposed to be placed pretty much close to 2 across the road from your property? 3 A That's correct. 4 Q And then in August of 2023, the company, 5 based on input, moved panels further away from your 6 property. 7 A We demanded them to be put back, and they're 8 still too close. 9 Q Okay. So you demanded that the panels be 10 removed, and they were moved, but you'd like them 11 further away? 12 A I don't want them at all. 13 Q You don't want them in Miller Township? 14 A I do not. 15 Q Okay. So you don't want any solar in Miller 16 Township? 17 A I do not. 18 Q Okay. 19 A I'm not opposed to solar on rooftops or, you 20 know, the smaller ones that people have in their 21 yards, but now this is prime farmland, it does not 22 belong there. 23 Q Now, how big is your parcel approximately? 24 A Well, we own 170 acres. 25 Q Is that contiguous to your house? 545 1 A Yes, it is. 2 Q Okay. And do you have screening behind your 3 house on two sides? 4 A Yes, I do. 5 Q You have screening between you and Mrs. 6 Thomas' property. Is that right? 7 A Those were always there. 8 Q I'm sorry? 9 A They were always there. We just put our 10 driveway next to it. 11 Q Now, Ms. Noble, does Preserve Knox County 12 disseminate any forms that people could fill out to 13 submit to the Power Siting Board to oppose the 14 project? 15 A Yeah, we sent quite a few, actually. I did. 16 Q And how did you send those? 17 A I scanned them and emailed those. 18 Q So let's go ahead and let me show you an 19 example. 20 MR. SETTINERI: Your Honor, we'll mark 21 Frasier PH3. It is a public comment, actually by Mrs. 22 Bartley, Beth Bartley, dated March 5th, 2020. 23 (Frasier Exhibit PH3 was marked for 24 identification.) 25 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 546 1 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you, Your Honor. 2 BY MR. SETTINERI: 3 Q Do you recognize that form? 4 A I guess I do, but I don't know if this is 5 the one that I sent in, and maybe I did. I've seen an 6 awful lot of paper these days. 7 Q Is this a form from Preserve Knox County 8 that was disseminated to people? 9 A I think this is just a generic form that we 10 pulled off, so yes. Is there a problem with the form? 11 Q Let me ask: Where did you pull that form 12 off? 13 A That I don't remember. 14 Q Okay. When you say "we," who's the we? 15 A "We" as in Preserve Knox County, Ohio. 16 Q And would this have been a form that members 17 of Preserve Knox County would hand out to people to 18 fill out? 19 A Absolutely. Why wouldn't we? 20 Q And you have other forms as well? 21 A Possibly. I see an awful lot. They were 22 seeing an awful lot from you. 23 Q Now, have you been on the Preserve Knox 24 County website? 25 A Not lately. 547 1 Q When was the last time you think you were on 2 it? 3 A Months ago. Maybe even longer. 4 MR. SETTINERI: Your Honor, mark 5 Frasier PH4. 6 (Frasier Exhibit PH4 was marked for 7 identification.) 8 And I'll represent it's a printout from 9 the Preserve Knox County website. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 11 BY MR. SETTINERI: 12 Q Ms. Noble, do you recognize this page being 13 from the home page of the Preserve Knox County 14 website? 15 A Yes, sir. I do. 16 Q Okay. And do you see there -- this will be 17 the home page, the website. 18 A I think, yep. 19 Q And you see the -- I can barely read it, but 20 there's a word, but there's a skull and crossbones 21 that says "toxicity." 22 A Correct. 23 Q And it says, "Solar panels contain a 24 substantial amount of toxic chemicals. Fragile. They 25 become damaged and leach into the soil, risking our 548 1 health and the health of our local wildlife." Do you 2 see that? 3 A Yes, I do. 4 Q All right. And there's a symbol for a fire 5 risk, property damages, and a cash grab on there, 6 right? 7 A Yes. 8 Q All right. And you believe that solar 9 panels are toxic? 10 A I do. As you do too, when you talked about 11 thin film panels in your staff report. 12 Q How do you address the fact that people have 13 solar panels on their houses, where their children 14 live, schools have panels? How do you reconcile that? 15 A Well, the Centerburg School did catch fire 16 because of solar panels, and that just happened last 17 year so -- 18 Q And that was on the roof, correct? 19 A That was on the roof, yes. 20 Q And they kept the solar panels in the field? 21 A They want them off, and they want those to 22 go. And the ones in the fields, I don't think work. 23 Q Okay. But they're still there? 24 A Yeah. 25 Q Okay. Again, how do you reconcile -- if 549 1 solar panels are toxic, how do you reconcile that 2 someone would put them on their house and potentially 3 have children in the house, children playing in the 4 yard? How do you reconcile that -- 5 A Well, that's their home, and they're not 6 affecting agriculture. That's on their home, that's 7 not taking up, you know, 1,000 acres of prime 8 farmland. I think that that's pretty common sense 9 right there. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: So as a reminder, let's 11 try not to talk about each other. It'll make it 12 easier for the court reporter to get us all down. 13 MR. SETTINERI: I'm guilty on that one. 14 BY MR. SETTINERI: 15 Q So in that instance of a panel being on a 16 roof, you don't view that as being a situation that 17 would lead to a risk of toxicity for residents? 18 A I do think it's a risk. 19 Q Okay. So you believe that solar panels 20 should not be on rooftops? 21 A I don't like them at all, but if somebody 22 wants to put them on their home, that is their home. 23 That is a huge difference in between a home catching 24 fire and 1,000 acres catching fire. 25 Q Now, you've attended Miller Township Trustee 550 1 meetings as part of your opposition to the project, 2 right? 3 A Yes, I have. 4 Q And you've attended Clinton Township Trustee 5 meetings as part of your opposition? 6 A Yes, I have. 7 Q Okay. And you're aware that Miller Township 8 residents are now attending the Clinton Township 9 Trustee meetings, correct? 10 A Yep. 11 Q Okay. Is that something you helped 12 organize? 13 A That is something that we asked the group to 14 go and sit and help other Clinton residents. 15 Q Now, I'm looking -- you submitted a 16 couple -- I know you submitted a public comment on the 17 docket, March 2nd, it looks like. But let me ask you 18 this question: Do you believe -- you believe that 19 residents living near a high voltage line in Miller 20 and Clinton Townships have experienced a high rate of 21 serious health issues, most probably caused by the 22 EMFs radiating from the lines and substations. Is 23 that correct? 24 A Is that what I wrote? 25 Q I'd be glad to show it. 551 1 A Could you please? 2 Q Yep, absolutely. More than glad to. 3 A Thank you, sir. Okay, thank you. Yep. 4 Q So what I read -- what I said was correct? 5 A That is correct. 6 Q Now, was the intent of the Preserve Knox 7 County website -- let me ask this another way. Do you 8 believe that the intent of the Preserve Knox County 9 website is to educate the public? 10 A I can't answer that because I wasn't the one 11 that set it up. 12 Q Do you view it as a tool to educate? 13 A I think it is a tool to educate. 14 Q And the home page is where people would land 15 when they came to that website? 16 A I think it's for anybody to go to that 17 website, no different than Frasier Solar's website. 18 MR. SETTINERI: No further questions. 19 Thank you very much. 20 THE WITNESS: Thank you, sir. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you for your 22 testimony. Actually, Ms. Noble, if you don't mind 23 coming back up. We have a few more questions for you. 24 THE REPORTER: Mr. Tavenor, could you 25 let him move away from the mic and then move up to it? 552 1 MR. TAVENOR: Yep. 2 THE REPORTER: Thank you. 3 MR. TAVENOR: Thank you. Sorry. 4 CROSS-EXAMINATION 5 BY MR. TAVENOR: 6 Q Hi. Just a few questions. 7 A Sure. 8 Q So you already established you're involved 9 with Preserve Knox County, correct? 10 A Yes. 11 Q What is your role with Preserve Knox County? 12 A I am the treasurer. 13 Q You're the treasurer, okay. So do you have 14 knowledge of the contributions that are coming into 15 Preserve Knox County? 16 A I do. 17 Q Great. So has this group received 18 contributions to support its work? 19 A We get donations. 20 Q Okay. So you receive donations. Do you 21 know, generally, the source of these donations? Do 22 you know them? Are some of them anonymous? 23 A If you would like, I can pull up the 24 receipts of the money I have spent. 25 Q You've spent money? 553 1 A Sure. 2 Q But you've received money as well? 3 A But we have received money when we've gone 4 to do, like, first Fridays. We take donations that 5 way. 6 Q Okay. Have you -- has Knox County received 7 any money from individuals or companies associated 8 with the oil and gas -- 9 A Absolutely not. 10 Q Are you familiar with the organization, the 11 Empowerment Alliance? 12 A I've been hearing a little bit about them, 13 yes. 14 Q Okay. In Knox County, when you're 15 developing your educational materials for the 16 community, where do you get that information? 17 A When we go to pass out the materials to the 18 public? Is that what you're talking about? 19 Q Yeah -- 20 A We do extensive research -- 21 Q And do you rely on -- 22 A And we have engineers in our group. 23 Q Great. So you rely on experts or other 24 individuals? 25 A Well, yeah. I guess some of those experts 554 1 are on the internet, yeah. 2 Q Do you have the names of any of those 3 people? 4 A You can look right in my box, or right in 5 the box. 6 Q So it's in the testimony -- 7 A Yeah, there's some information in there. 8 MR. TAVENOR: All right. All right. 9 Thank you. 10 MS. NOBLE: You're welcome. Thank you. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other questions? 12 No? 13 Thank you. 14 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Mr. Settineri, your 16 exhibits? 17 MR. SETTINERI: Yes. Exhibits we'd 18 like to put into the hearing record, Exhibits Frasier 19 PH2, Frasier PH3, Frasier PH4. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Any objections? 21 Hearing none, all three exhibits are admitted to the 22 record. 23 (Frasier Exhibits PH2, PH3, and PH4 24 were received into evidence.) 25 Our next witness is Karen Schmitt. 555 1 Good evening. I think it's evening. 2 MS. SCHMITT: Good evening. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: You are an intervenor in 4 this case, correct? 5 MS. SCHMITT: I am. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: And you're aware your 7 counsel is not present tonight? 8 MS. SCHMITT: I am. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: You acknowledge that if 10 you testify tonight, that you're subject to 11 cross-examination with -- 12 MS. SCHMITT: I do. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: Perfect. And then in 14 the alternative, you may choose to come testify at the 15 evidentiary hearing that begins on August 19, 2024, in 16 lieu of testifying tonight. 17 MS. SCHMITT: Okay. My husband is 18 testifying at that hearing, so I'll testify tonight. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: You want to testify 20 tonight? Okay. 21 MS. SCHMITT: Thank you. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Please raise your right 23 hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 24 MS. SCHMITT: Yes. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please state 556 1 your name for the record. 2 THE WITNESS: Karen, K-A-R-E-N, 3 Schmitt, S-C-H-M-I-T-T. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 5 address, including your township. 6 THE WITNESS: 5952 Rangeline Road, 7 Mount Vernon, Township Morgan. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you reside or 9 work within the project area? 10 THE WITNESS: Both. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, please proceed. 12 DIRECT STATEMENT 13 THE WITNESS: My name is Karen Schmitt. 14 I reside at 5952 Rangeline Road, Mount Vernon, Ohio. 15 I am an intervenor in the Knox County Frasier Solar 16 Project, 23-0796-EL-BGN. I am opposed to this 17 project. Thank you for taking the time tonight to 18 listen to the people who live here and who will be 19 adversely affected by this project. 20 We've already heard many people talk 21 about how this project will destroy beautiful rolling 22 hills, miles of crops, and grassy fields, which 23 provide home for various species of wildlife, 24 including birds, sandhill cranes, deer, foxes, 25 rabbits, and others. Also, how using prime farmland 557 1 will affect the agricultural use of the land. 2 Diminishing food supply, breaking tiles, causing 3 flooding, and potentially toxic chemicals leaching 4 from the cracked panels and leaky batteries. 5 Our property is situated directly 6 across from part of this project that is in Miller 7 Township. Instead of the open field which currently 8 produces corn, soybeans, alfalfa, and hay, the arrays 9 of solar panels planned for these fields would 10 directly affect our property, which sits lower in 11 elevation. Our property would be directly impacted by 12 excess water from runoff, causing possible flooding 13 and a breach in the safety of our well. 14 The underground water on our land 15 culminates into a five-acre wetland, which is home to 16 a variety of plants and animals. The impact and 17 disruption of these ecosystems would send a ripple 18 effect to many species of wildlife that use the fields 19 for habitation, nesting, and flight. 20 Our livelihood would also be impacted 21 as we are feature hosts to guests who rent our cabins 22 to relax in a natural setting while enjoying the 23 wildlife and tranquility of our land. Our guests want 24 to listen to the beautiful sounds of nature, not noisy 25 inverters from an industrial solar -- 558 1 JUDGE SANDOR: Ms. Schmitt, can you 2 slow down just a tad? I know you're under time 3 pressure too, but if you could help us, help the court 4 reporter. We're transcribing. 5 THE WITNESS: Do I need to repeat 6 anything? 7 THE REPORTER: No, thank you. 8 THE WITNESS: Okay, is it okay to 9 begin? 10 THE REPORTER: Yes. 11 THE WITNESS: Okay, thank you. 12 We can learn from other states, like, 13 Michigan, where Jim Sheridan [ph] shares from personal 14 experience about the flooding, noise, decrease in food 15 production, and chaos, the Ranger Power Project in 16 Shiawassee County, Michigan has caused. 17 What about the four-day fire that 18 burned in Chaumont, New York? The battery storage 19 caught fire, releasing potentially toxic fumes into 20 the air. Residents were contained in their homes. 21 We can look at Europe, where the Green 22 Deal passed in 2020, experienced two years later, the 23 reopening of dozens of coal plants and 25 natural gas 24 import terminals for drilling and gas production, 25 Gorham 2023. Why? Because solar power isn't 559 1 reliable. We have never had to be concerned if our 2 hospitals, offices, or homes would go without power 3 because the grid didn't have enough power to 4 facilitate energy. But now, this is a real question 5 we must ask ourselves. 6 Can Ohio foresee the expensive, coming 7 renewable energy failure and protectively -- 8 proactively protect its citizens from blackouts? The 9 data from the April 4th public hearing shows nearly 70 10 percent, 234 of the people attended are opposed to 11 this project, while 31 percent, 104 people support it. 12 38 percent of the 104 have Mount Vernon addresses. 13 The rest live elsewhere. 14 I ask on behalf of the property owners 15 who do not want this project in our backyards to 16 please consider our property rights, to continue to 17 live in the tranquil, rural areas that we've chosen. 18 I ask you to protect Ohio's grid and to continue to 19 provide reliable electricity to power it. And on 20 behalf of the many species of wildlife who would be 21 adversely affected as some of your title state, please 22 conserve and protect our environment by denying this 23 project. Thank you very much for your time. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 25 And any questions from counsel? 560 1 CROSS-EXAMINATION 2 BY MR. SETTINERI: 3 Q Good evening, Ms. Schmitt. 4 A Good evening. 5 Q You submitted some public comments in this 6 case, right? 7 A Yes. 8 Q All right. 9 A And I have them right here. 10 Q Do you have both of them? 11 A I do. 12 Q Do you have the ones dated March 5th, 2024? 13 A I do not. 14 Q You don't? Okay. Do you have one that's 15 dated -- well -- February 15th? 16 A I do not. As stated in my testimony, I have 17 them from April 4th. 18 Q Let's go ahead and mark a couple exhibits 19 here. Frasier PH5. It's a public comment from Karen 20 Schmitt, dated -- docketed February 15, 2024. And 21 then Frasier PH6 would be a public comment, docketed 22 March 5th by 2024 by Karen Schmitt at 5952 Ridgeline 23 Road. And that's your address, right? 24 A Correct. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked for Frasier 561 1 PH5 and PH6. 2 (Frasier Exhibit PH5 and Exhibit PH6 3 were marked for identification.) 4 BY MR. SETTINERI: 5 Q Do you have Fraiser PH5 and PH6? 6 A I do. 7 Q Are those your public comments? At least 8 some of your public comments? 9 A Yes. 10 Q Okay. So both of those comments are from 11 forms that were given to you, correct? 12 A Everything that I wrote today was from me. 13 Q In your statement? 14 A Yes. 15 Q The forms I gave you, Frasier PH5 and 16 Frasier PH6, those are forms that people could fill 17 out and send in to the Power Siting Board, right? 18 A That's correct. 19 Q Okay. And you did that on this too -- 20 A I did. 21 Q And who gave -- where did you get those 22 forms? 23 A A neighbor. 24 Q And what neighbor? 25 A I don't remember his name. 562 1 Q Okay. 2 A He lives further down the road from us. 3 Q All right. And you see on the one, Frasier 4 -- he one that's dated February 15, 2024 -- let me 5 make sure I don't get -- Frasier PH5. Do you see that 6 statement that, first bullet point, "There is a major 7 high voltage line running north, south, through Miller 8 and Clinton Townships. In one current AB substation 9 on Sharp Road, residents living near these areas have 10 experienced a high rate of serious health issues, most 11 probably caused by the MS radiating from the lines and 12 substation." Do you see that? 13 A I do. 14 Q -- the whole bullet point. Okay. Now, 15 these forms, both forms, Frasier PH6 and Frasier PH5, 16 they came from Preserve Knox County, right? 17 A Possibly. 18 Q Okay. And do you agree with that first 19 bullet point statement, yourself? 20 A I do. 21 MR. SETTINERI: All right. No further 22 questions. Thank you, Ms. Schmitt. 23 THE WITNESS: Thank you. Do you want 24 these back? 25 MR. SETTINERI: You can leave those. 563 1 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other -- okay. We 2 have some more questions for you, Ms. Schmitt. 3 CROSS-EXAMINATION 4 BY MR. TAVENOR: 5 Q Good evening. 6 A Good evening. 7 Q Good evening. Oop. There we go. Good 8 evening. 9 A Good evening. 10 Q Just a few questions for you. In your 11 testimony, you mentioned the idea of blackouts and 12 solar, it relating to blackouts, correct? 13 A If our grade cannot support the lack of 14 electricity that solar panels produce in Ohio. 15 Q Are you familiar with the concept of peak 16 demand? 17 A Where the energy stored throughout the seven 18 hours of sunlight during the day is supposedly put 19 into batteries and then used at a later time? 20 Q No. So when, during the day, would you say 21 we're using the most electricity? 22 A Probably 5, 6 p.m., when people are home. 23 Q How much power do you think AC uses, air 24 conditioning? 25 A I'm not an electric expert. I don't know. 564 1 Q Do you think it uses a lot of electricity? 2 A Possibly. 3 Q Do you think when people are at work 4 throughout the day that their businesses are using a 5 lot of electricity? 6 A Possibly. 7 Q So during the day, you know, from the hours 8 of, say, 10 to 6 p.m. for a lot of the year, that's 9 when the sun is out? 10 A Correct. 11 Q So if solar panels are operating during the 12 time when the sun is out the most and when a lot of 13 electricity is being used, it's probably a benefit to 14 the grid then? 15 A Maybe, maybe not. 16 MR. TAVENOR: No further questions. 17 Thank you. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Thank you for 19 your testimony. 20 THE WITNESS: You're welcome. 21 MR. SETTINERI: Your Honor, we'd like 22 to admit Frasier PH5 and PH6 into the hearing record, 23 please. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Any objections? 25 MR. HOLTHUS: No, I would like copies 565 1 though, Mike. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. No objections. 3 Frasier PH5 and PH6 are admitted. 4 (Frasier Exhibit PH5 and Exhibit PH6 5 were received into evidence.) 6 Our next registered witness is Brenda 7 McCament. 8 Good evening. I'd like to just 9 clarify, you are an intervenor, correct? 10 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes. Yes, I am. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And you're aware 12 that your counsel is not present tonight? 13 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes, I am. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 15 if you testify tonight, that you're subject to 16 cross-examination without counsel? 17 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes, I'm aware. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. And in the 19 alternative, you may present your testimony at the 20 August 24th evidentiary hearing, but you move to 21 testify tonight? 22 MS. MCCAMENT: Correct, but I don't 23 want to. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. You want to 25 testify tonight? 566 1 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes, tonight. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. Please raise 3 your right hand. 4 MS. MCCAMENT: My name is Brenda 5 McCament. Oh, sorry. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: I'll swear you in first. 7 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: Do you swear to tell the 9 truth? 10 MS. MCCAMENT: Yes. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please state 12 and spell your name for the record. 13 THE WITNESS: My name is Brenda 14 McCament, B-R-E-N-D-A, McCament M-C-C-A-M-E-N-T. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 16 address, including your township. 17 THE WITNESS: I live at 7942 Granville 18 Road, Mount Vernon in Clinton Township. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 20 reside within the project area? 21 THE WITNESS: I live and work in the 22 project area. It's south of me. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, thank you. Please 24 proceed. 25 // 567 1 DIRECT STATEMENT 2 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 3 I am opposed to the Frasier Solar 4 Project. This project was hidden well enough that 5 there are citizens to this day that don't know this is 6 a proposed project in our community. We received the 7 Good Neighbor Agreement. After reading it, I was not 8 happy and did not want any part of the hush money. We 9 ended up receiving two more unsolicited agreements in 10 the mail. They were left unsigned. 11 I did my due diligence when I heard 12 that Open Roads met with a farmer's group a couple of 13 years ago or so, and I contacted one of my Clinton 14 Township trustees. Later, after a face-to-face 15 conversation about solar, I gave the trustee a copy of 16 the Good Neighbor Agreement because he said he had not 17 seen one. 18 Later, in the summer of 2023, after 19 finding two men looking for survey markers and digging 20 up my yard, is when I found out more when they 21 unfolded a map showing me the project area closest to 22 me. I contacted my trustee again. After all of that 23 contact with him over a span of time, I never once was 24 told that Open Roads, from out of state, was sitting 25 at all of the Clinton Township meetings. 568 1 The Township never sent out any 2 communication about this proposed project. I am not 3 on Facebook or any other social media site. We were 4 blindsided by Open Roads and our trustees. We would 5 have attended the meetings if we would have known 6 about the project. 7 Agrivoltaics is a term, in my opinion, 8 that appears to make the ruination of farmland more 9 palatable. I don't find a permanent sheep grazing 10 plan. Dropping lambs out in the field without 11 supervision doesn't seem like a plan to me. The care 12 and shelter for them is not defined either. 13 Page 12 of the application states, 14 "After an initial transition period, supplemented by 15 mechanical cutting or as long as local sheep grazers 16 are available and interested in providing such 17 services and as long as such services are cost 18 effective." On page 54, of the staff report, line 19 item 21 states, "At least 30 days prior to the 20 pre-construction conference, the applicant shall file 21 a copy of the agrivoltaics plan," et cetera. It's too 22 long. That's after the hearings. It makes it sound 23 like it's an option and not a solid plan. 24 A long-lasting impact of 26 miles of 25 conduit or communication cable or whatever it's called 569 1 that is going to be left in the ground after the 2 project is decommissioned. How is that good? There 3 are no construction drawings, just maps with a concept 4 drawing feel. 5 What about compliance during 6 construction and production after? There are a lot of 7 rules and regulations to follow. Is there a fine or 8 some sort of consequence if the regulations weren't 9 followed? 10 What about the impact being surrounded 11 on four sides by inverters and panels at John and 12 Norma Parker's property? How about the other families 13 surrounded on three sides? Even two sides is too 14 many. Setbacks don't erase the impact of an unnatural 15 landscape. The behemoth project is so spread out, it 16 looks like an unorganized plague is going to be 17 released upon our prime farmland. 18 Governments don't like urban sprawl. 19 This kind of sprawl is better. How much more prime 20 farmland are they going to grab for solar? What about 21 the high cost of this kind of energy? Solar companies 22 are adding a burden to our already fragile grid. 23 Renewables don't produce all the time like all the 24 other power plants. They need a lot of backup. 25 We need more natural gas and nuclear 570 1 plants that are always on, always working. Let's stop 2 the closure of any more power plants. Let's secure 3 our existing grid. Remember Texas? The government is 4 using our tax money for renewables instead of reducing 5 our deficit. The government is busy mandating 6 electric for everyone, without the infrastructure to 7 supply that power. They know this. What is their 8 plan? 9 And thank you for letting me speak 10 today. And I wanted to let you know that the 11 articles, and I have many more at home but I just 12 couldn't bring them all, are kind of what helped me 13 form my opinion in my research. Thank you. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 15 Any questions from counsel? 16 CROSS-EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. SETTINERI: 18 Q Good evening, Ms. McCament. 19 A Mr. Settineri. 20 Q You're a member of Preserve Knox County? 21 A Yes. 22 Q And you're an intervenor in the case? 23 A Yes. 24 Q And when did you join Preserve Knox County? 25 A I went to my first meeting at the public 571 1 library, around August, I believe. 2 Q Of 2023? 3 A Yeah, of 2023, and we did not join 4 immediately. 5 Q And how did you join? 6 A At the library with a piece of paper. There 7 was a membership form, yeah. 8 Q And is it fair to say the distance from your 9 residence to the project is about 0.3 miles, 1700 feet 10 or so. Does that sound about right? 11 A Yeah. 12 MR. SETTINERI: And no further 13 questions for me. Thank you. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Any other 15 questions? 16 Okay, thank you for your testimony. 17 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Our next witness is Rick 19 McCament. 20 Good evening. Just to make sure, you 21 are an intervenor, correct? 22 MR. MCCAMENT: That is correct. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. And you're 24 aware that your counsel is not present tonight? 25 MR. MCCAMENT: Understood. 572 1 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. And you 2 acknowledge that if you testify tonight, that you'll 3 be subject to cross-examination without your counsel? 4 MR. MCCAMENT: Correct. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: And that, in the 6 alternative, you can provide testimony at the 7 evidentiary hearing in this proceeding with your 8 counsel present? 9 MR. MCCAMENT: Agreed. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And you choose to 11 testify tonight? 12 MR. MCCAMENT: Yes, sir. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Please raise your 14 right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 15 MR. MCCAMENT: I do. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please state 17 and spell your name for the record. 18 THE WITNESS: Rick, R-I-C-K M- 19 C-C-A-M-E-N-T. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 21 address, including the township. 22 THE WITNESS: 7942 Granville Road, 23 Mount Vernon, Ohio, Clinton Township. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 25 reside within the project area? 573 1 THE WITNESS: I reside in the project 2 area. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please 4 proceed. 5 DIRECT STATEMENT 6 THE WITNESS: I cannot, for the life of 7 me, figure out why I'm here. Let alone why I'm 8 standing at this podium speaking. I also cannot 9 figure out why my friends and my neighbors are also 10 here doing the same thing. We get paid to do other 11 things. We live in a representative republic. No 12 matter what you hear or what you have been told, to 13 date, we are a representative republic. We are by no 14 means a democracy. 15 I attended a Clinton Township Trustee 16 meeting sometime in October of 2023. The meeting was 17 concerning the Frasier Solar Project in Clinton and 18 Miller Townships. I was surprised at what I heard and 19 the reactions of the three trustees from Clinton 20 Township. Their response to any question or comments 21 from the citizens were they were neutral. I have 22 attended the Clinton Township meetings consistently 23 since, and the trustees still maintain that they are 24 neutral to this very day. 25 Our county commissioners, Thom Collier, 574 1 Chuck Purcell [ph], Theresa Bemiller, were also 2 responding that they were also neutral on the Frasier 3 Solar Project. I was told at the Clinton Township 4 meeting several times by Donna Hochstetler that she 5 felt there were as many citizens for this project, if 6 not more, against it. 7 Sometime before the primary election of 8 2024, a letter of intent was released from our three 9 county commissioners stating they were unanimously in 10 support of the Frasier Solar Project. That doesn't 11 seem neutral to me. 12 I participated in a signature drive 13 petitioning the Clinton Township Trustees to sign a 14 resolution against specifically the Frasier Solar 15 Project in Clinton Township. There were over 350 16 signatures collected from Clinton Township citizens. 17 When presented to the trustees, they responded they 18 would not sign a resolution and they were, once again, 19 neutral. 20 The board has received countless 21 letters, testimonies, petitions from residents of Knox 22 County in opposition of this solar project. The Knox 23 County Commissioners and Clinton Township Trustees 24 have silenced our voices. They have violated our 25 civil rights, the Ohio Revised Code Section B504, and 575 1 the Constitution's Bill of Rights, Amendment 1. 2 We expect the board to reject the 3 Frasier Solar Project based on we the people of Knox 4 County have not been represented in this case as 5 should have been in a representative republic. As for 6 the politicians who have violated our rights, we the 7 people will deal with that matter at the voting 8 booths. That's all. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 10 Questions from counsel? 11 CROSS-EXAMINATION 12 BY MR. SETTINERI: 13 Q Good evening, Mr. McCament. 14 A Yes, sir. 15 Q Thank you for coming tonight. 16 A You bet. 17 Q Real quick. You agree, the Ohio Power 18 Siding Board will decide whether this project gets a 19 certificate, correct? 20 A That's the way I understand it. 21 Q And so, the Miller Township Trustees will 22 not decide whether this project goes forward. 23 A I understand that too. 24 Q And the Clinton Township Trustees -- 25 A I understand that completely. 576 1 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. And we have 2 to be careful we don't talk over each other for the 3 court reporter to get the question. 4 THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. 5 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Let's let him finish the 7 questions real quick before we respond, if you don't 8 mind. 9 THE WITNESS: Could you repeat that? 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Please let him finish 11 his questions before we respond. 12 THE WITNESS: I got you. Sorry. 13 BY MR. SETTINERI: 14 Q You mentioned a letter of intent, I think, 15 by the county commissioners. 16 A Sure. 17 Q Did you have a copy of that in the other -- 18 A I have a copy of it at my desk. I don't 19 have it with me. 20 Q And will you describe that letter again for 21 me, please. 22 A It was a letter from all three of the county 23 commissioners showing their support for the Frasier 24 Solar Project, and it was stated at the bottom of that 25 letter that it was unanimous. 577 1 Q And would that be available on the county 2 website? 3 A Not sure. 4 Q Where did you get the letter? 5 A I really can't tell you sir. 6 Q Okay. Now, one thing, as an intervenor you 7 get to participate in this case, right? 8 A I'm right here right now. 9 Q And you can even -- your lawyer can cross- 10 examine our witnesses at the evidentiary hearing. Is 11 that your understanding? 12 A Say that again. 13 Q As an intervenor in the case, you have 14 rights, and one of those rights is the ability to have 15 your counsel cross-examine our witnesses at the 16 evidentiary hearing, which is August 19th? Just like 17 tonight I'm here asking you questions. 18 A Got it. 19 Q All right. So is it fair to say that your 20 voice has not been silenced in this case, correct? 21 A By my local politicians, it has been 22 because, I feel, that this board would certainly base 23 their opinion or their decision based on our local 24 politicians because we have elected them to represent 25 us. Not the other way around. So as far as I 578 1 understand the United States of America and our 2 system, that our representatives, we've elected them 3 to represent us in cases like this to the board. 4 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. No further 5 questions. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Any other 7 questions from counsel? 8 Okay. Thank you for your testimony. 9 The next registered witness is Susan 10 Moore. 11 You're an intervenor. Is that correct? 12 MS. MOORE: Yes, I am. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: And you're aware that 14 your counsel is not present tonight? 15 MS. MOORE: Yes, I am. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And if you do 17 testify tonight, you acknowledge that you're subject 18 to cross-examination without your counsel? 19 MS. MOORE: That's correct. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: And that, in the 21 alternative, you can present your testimony at the 22 evidentiary hearing in this proceeding with your 23 counsel present? 24 MS. MOORE: Yes, I am. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And you choose to 579 1 testify tonight? 2 MS. MOORE: That's correct. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. Please raise 4 your hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 5 MS. MOORE: I do. 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 7 your name for the record. 8 THE WITNESS: My name is Susan Moore, 9 S-U-S-A-N Moore, M-O-O-R-E. My address is 12681 10 Butcher Road, Mount Vernon, and I'm in Miller 11 Township. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work reside 13 in the project area? 14 THE WITNESS: Yeah, my farm is right -- 15 butts right up to it. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Please proceed. 17 DIRECT STATEMENT 18 THE WITNESS: Absolutely. Thank you, 19 first of all, for hearing us all out. Appreciate it. 20 Again, my name is Susan Moore. My 21 husband and I live in Miller Township on Butcher Road. 22 Our farm borders the proposed Frasier Solar Project. 23 What is Knox County? Knox County is 24 known for being the heart of Ohio, a beautiful, highly 25 productive agricultural county in the state of Ohio. 580 1 Whether you travel on Route 661 from Mount Vernon to 2 Granville or Route 13 to Mansfield or Newark or Route 3 3 from Columbus, you will see acres upon acres of 4 planted fields of grain and hay. Though beautiful, 5 charts do show us that our state is in the lower third 6 of sunny states. 7 Solar. I don't know. Our farm 8 originated 46 years ago as a small farm out in the 9 country, about an hour from the big city, which is 10 Columbus. Our son is in our family farm partnership 11 with us, and our grandson hopes to join in the future. 12 We've taken time and money to build a lasting legacy. 13 It's our life, as many others have done. 14 We've worked and used progressive 15 farming practices and methods. With the help of our 16 local soil and water district, we've installed 17 drainage tile and waterways to deal with excess water 18 and run of storm runoff. The proposed site is of 19 higher elevation and will most definitely cause 20 extreme storm water runoff downstream, maxing out our 21 installed waterways and drainage tile system, if the 22 existing tile and drainage system on the proposed site 23 are not intact due to the damage that will occur when 24 the posts for the panels are installed. 25 Thousands of these posts will be 581 1 punched or drilled down through the tile, possibly 2 making it inoperable. This is where the surface water 3 runoff problems will occur, damaging our waterways and 4 require extra work of repair and seeding on our land. 5 We have met with Open Roads Renewable 6 manager Craig Adair, his engineer, and a drainage 7 consultant at our farm border of the proposed site. 8 Our township trustees were also in attendance, as they 9 are concerned about the impact of the storm water 10 issues downstream on our township road culverts. We 11 are strongly convinced after our meeting and messages 12 from Craig Adair that many of these problems are not 13 even understood, which we feel comes from the reality 14 that he lives in Austin, Texas, where it is mostly 15 sunny, dry, and excess water runoff has most likely 16 not been dealt with us a whole lot. 17 And on another note, I am not prone to 18 bashing people or companies, but we have never dealt 19 with or would we deal with a company that offers 20 thousands of dollars to people to keep quiet and/or 21 speak positively about their agenda. This company 22 appears ruthless with one agenda. It does not appear 23 to be having the good neighbor aspect or be an 24 ethically good business. We have been in business and 25 never have dealt like this. 582 1 My trust of them and their word is not 2 good. I wish I felt differently, but I see only 3 questionable red flags as time goes on. 4 In conclusion, we are strongly opposed 5 to this Frasier Solar Project and any others in our 6 state that take prime farmland out of production. I 7 believe this is a subtle undermining of our area and 8 states, that, if not stopped will eventually take the 9 food availability out of our country. I hope that you 10 will consider my thoughts and dig deeper into the 11 negative reality of this project and ones like it and 12 put a stop to our prime farmland being used like this. 13 Thank you for listening. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Questions for counsel? 15 MR. SETTINERI: A few questions. 16 CROSS-EXAMINATION 17 BY MR. SETTINERI: 18 Q Good evening, Ms. Moore. 19 A Good evening. 20 Q My name is Mike Settineri, on behalf of 21 Frasier Solar. Now, you're an intervenor in the case? 22 A Yes, I am. 23 Q And you are a member of Preserve Knox 24 County? 25 A Yes, I am. 583 1 Q And when did you join your organization? 2 A I really couldn't tell you that. It's been 3 a while, probably last year. I don't know. 4 Q Now, you mentioned that the project, at 5 least near your properties, that property is a higher 6 elevation? 7 A Yes, it is. Most definitely. 8 Q Is there runoff from that area today? 9 A Yes, there is. 10 Q Okay. How do you know -- 11 A Forty-some years of farming and we know the 12 -- what it does to with the waterways that we have 13 installed. It's at max. 14 Q Okay. So there's runoff from the 15 neighboring properties onto your property? 16 A From the site, the proposed site, yes. 17 There's always been -- there's always a lot of 18 stormwater runoff. 19 Q And you manage that how, specifically? 20 A With waterways. We have -- we -- we have to 21 build new ones. We have to seed and keep them up and 22 keep them repaired. 23 Q Okay. And if the drain tile is not 24 maintained after the project is built, if the drain 25 tile is damaged and not maintained, you're concerned 584 1 there could be -- 2 A There definitely will be. 3 Q -- storm runoff? 4 A Yes, absolutely. 5 Q That could then exceed what you've done on 6 your property? 7 A Exactly. 8 Q Now, have you looked at the staff report 9 that was issued for this case? 10 A I briefly have seen a few -- I'm sorry. 11 Are you talking about the sheet that'll be on there? 12 Q No, there's a -- the Power Siding Board 13 issued a staff report recommendation for the project. 14 A And who checks that out? That's what I, you 15 know, once this is installed, I guess, yes, I 16 understand that. 17 Q And do you know there are at least two 18 conditions, at least, on addressing drainage in the 19 project site? 20 A Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 21 Q And have you reviewed those at all? 22 A Yes, I've seen where there is. 23 Q And that doesn't address those conditions, 24 don't address your concerns? 25 A No. 585 1 Q Now, if the drain tile is maintained on the 2 project site, as you would like it to be, then you 3 should be okay on your storm and your runoff in your 4 area, correct, with what you designed? 5 A If the drain tile is maintained. I want to 6 know who would be monitoring that. And there would 7 have to be more people than what we've had come to our 8 place because it hasn't succeeded. 9 Q And are you aware that the Power Siding 10 Board has a compliance team that monitors the 11 structure? 12 A Oh, yes, I'm very aware. 13 Q Good. Now, you mentioned about the 14 agreements that you found that bothered you. I know 15 they've been called different things, hush money, 16 things of that nature, right? 17 A Mm-hmm. 18 Q Now, are you aware that good neighbor 19 agreements are very common in the power industry for 20 power plants, gas-fired power plants, coal plants -- 21 plants, wind firearms, and utility-scale solar? 22 A No. 23 Q And whether someone likes to sign a good 24 neighbor agreement is up to them, correct? 25 A That's right, definitely. 586 1 Q And you made that decision? 2 A That's right. 3 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. All right. No 4 further questions. Thank you. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other questions, 6 counsel? All right. No. Thank you for your 7 testimony. 8 Our next witness is Patti Dice. 9 So let me clarify, you are an 10 intervenor in this proceeding? 11 MS. DICE: Yes, sir. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. You're aware 13 that your counsel is not present tonight? 14 MS. DICE: Yes. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 16 if you testify this evening that you're subject to 17 cross-examination without any counsel present? 18 MS. DICE: Yes, sir. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: And that, in the 20 alternative, you could testify at the evidentiary 21 hearing in this proceeding with your counsel present? 22 MS. DICE: Correct, yes. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And you're 24 choosing to testify tonight? 25 MS. DICE: Yes, sir. 587 1 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please raise 2 your right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 3 MS. DICE: Yes. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 5 your name for the record. 6 THE WITNESS: My name is Patti Dice, 7 P-A-T-T-I D-I-C-E. My address is 13558 Miller Road, 8 Mount Vernon. And I live in Miller Township. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: And you work or reside 10 in the project area? 11 THE WITNESS: I live there. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. Please 13 proceed. 14 DIRECT STATEMENT 15 THE WITNESS: I am not being paid for 16 my testimony, nor will I financially benefit from it. 17 I am vehemently opposed to industrial solar in Knox 18 County for several reasons that have already been 19 stated by previous speakers that oppose industrial 20 solar. 21 The projected solar fields by Frasier 22 Solar will be visible from where I live. This will be 23 a disgrace to beautiful Knox County, specifically 24 Miller Township. I love living out in the country and 25 seeing all of the beauty that surrounds me on a daily 588 1 basis. I love my view. For those that say I should 2 have bought the land if I love my view so much, your 3 land was not for sale, nor is it now -- 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Sir, please. 5 THE WITNESS: However, you are willing 6 to lease it for the right price. Industrial solar 7 would destroy the beauty that surrounds me. 8 Aside from me, industrial solar would 9 displace the wildlife habitat we have in the area. 10 The fences would severely limit their habitat. I get 11 to see and enjoy deer, pheasants, wild turkey, various 12 birds, woodpeckers, owls, and an occasional fox. I 13 also get to see raccoons, skunks, vultures, and 14 possums that may not be so enjoyable, but are a very 15 important part of the local animal life cycle. 16 The industrial solar farms may add 17 sheep to the area, but the areas where the solar farms 18 have been proposed currently farm wheat, corn, and 19 soybeans, thus taking a food source away from other 20 farm animals, thus taking away my food source. I love 21 going to Lanning's to get the meat that has been 22 locally sourced. What will happen to this? 23 Why are businesses not offering up 24 their rooftops? Why are parking garages not offering 25 up their rooftops? Intel and Amazon's rooftop would 589 1 be a great space for industrial solar. Could they 2 also use parking lots and provide shelter for their 3 employees' vehicles? I haven't done the research on 4 this, but it is a thought. 5 Other thoughts to ponder: How many of 6 us will still own our land in 40 years? I hope to, 7 but there are no guarantees. Can the land be sold, 8 and if so, who is going to buy it? 9 Number two: Does Ohio have enough 10 sunlight to produce the energy that is promised? 11 "Sunlight may be unlimited, but the materials required 12 to manufacture solar technology are not. The 13 availability of the raw materials required to produce 14 solar products may not be sufficient to meet future 15 demand. And the options for mining these materials 16 can have a significant environmental impact." My 17 source is cited. 18 Number three: Solar energy cannot be 19 collected at night. "Not even big systems, like a 20 12-kilowatt solar system can collect solar energy at 21 night." My source is cited. 22 Number four: "High winds often whip 23 around these structures, making them howl like 24 banshees." My source is cited. Who wants this, 25 whether it is during the day or night? 590 1 How expensive is it to store solar 2 energy? "A single lead acid battery can cost between 3 $200 and $800 while a residential lithium-ion solar 4 system can cost $7,000 to $14,000." My source is 5 cited. 6 Solar panels are touted to last 25 to 7 30 years, yet the contracts are for 40 years. Hmm, 8 there's some math that does not add up there. 9 Number seven: Disposal and recycling 10 options are limited. What areas are being littered by 11 broken or non-functional panels? 12 Number eight: The mining of materials 13 and manufacturing of solar panels creates a 14 considerable amount of greenhouse gas. 15 "Transportation and installation of solar systems have 16 been associated with the emission of greenhouse 17 gases." My source is cited. 18 Number nine: With all the solar farms 19 going up in the nation, where will people eventually 20 live? Over the weekend, on Sunday, I did travel to 21 Southern Ohio, very sad. 22 Number ten: Why is someone from Texas 23 coming to Ohio to build a solar field? 24 Number 11: How many of the pro-solar 25 people that have spoken before me would buy property 591 1 right next to an industrial solar field? I have heard 2 one so far, and he spoke last Thursday. As a local 3 middle school teacher, I see how kids are affected 4 every day by the various mental health factors that 5 they face. I cannot imagine the effects, the health 6 effects, construction, noise, obstruction, et cetera, 7 industrial solar would have on the mental health of my 8 neighbors. 9 Yes, the local school district to which 10 I work does stand to benefit greatly from this. 11 However, no amount of money is worth jeopardizing the 12 livelihood, wellbeing and mental health of my 13 neighbors and my community. Not to mention the 14 potential for hazardous materials to leach into the 15 groundwater, threatening residents, livestock and 16 wildlife. 17 My personal dream of owning a house in 18 beautiful Miller Township in Knox County will be 19 crushed if industrial solar is permitted. Please, 20 please, do not allow industrial solar. Thank you for 21 this opportunity to address you. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Any questions from 23 counsel? 24 // 25 // 592 1 CROSS-EXAMINATION 2 BY MR. SETTINERI: 3 Q You're a member of Preserve Knox County, 4 correct? 5 A Yes, sir. 6 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you very much, 7 that's it. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Thank you. Any 9 other questions? 10 Okay. Thank you for your testimony. 11 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. The next 13 registered witness is Don Moore. Okay. Is there 14 another Don Moore? Okay. Thank you. 15 The next is Sarah Ann Dean. 16 You're an intervenor in this 17 proceeding? 18 MS. DEAN: Yes. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. You're aware 20 your counsel's not present this evening? 21 MS. DEAN: Yes. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you acknowledge 23 that if you testify this evening, that you'll be 24 subject to cross-examination without your counsel 25 present? 593 1 MS. DEAN: Yes. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: And that, in the 3 alternative, you may provide testimony at the 4 evidentiary hearing in this proceeding in lieu of 5 tonight? 6 MS. DEAN: I understand. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. And you're 8 choosing to testify tonight? 9 MS. DEAN: Yes. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please raise 11 your right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 12 MS. DEAN: Yes. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 14 your name for the record. 15 THE WITNESS: My name is Sarah Ann 16 Dean, S-A-R-A-H A-N-N D-E-A-N. 17 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 18 address, including the township. 19 THE WITNESS: 6041 Sharp Road, Mount 20 Vernon, Ohio, Miller Township. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 22 reside within the project area? 23 THE WITNESS: I both live and 24 homeschool in the project area. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Please proceed. 594 1 DIRECT STATEMENT 2 THE WITNESS: I am strongly opposed to 3 the Frasier Solar Project. I have several reasons. 4 One, my family's home would be surrounded within about 5 half a mile on all sides. We would have no way to get 6 to Mount Vernon without passing solar fields and 7 crossing underground transmission lines. 8 Two, our property abuts a large 9 upstream field in the project. We are concerned about 10 construction runoff due to the land degrading and 11 miles of trenching. A large influx of mud would 12 decimate the ecosystem of our creek, Delano Run, and 13 imperil the pristine waters of Kokosing, a state 14 scenic river about two miles away, which is used for 15 outdoor tourism with the Kokosing Gap Trail 16 overlooking the river for miles after our creek meets 17 it. This outdoor tourism is an important drawing 18 point for the city of Mount Vernon. 19 Three, based on the Berkeley study on 20 solar neighbors' property value loss, which caps out 21 at 12-acre plots and other studies, we expect a 22 significant loss somewhere between 10 and 30 percent. 23 This study showcases the reason why zoning laws are 24 important to balance the rights of various property 25 owners. America is not a nation of land-bearing 595 1 dictators. 2 Four, we intentionally bought a smaller 3 house so that we could afford land, a little over 20 4 acres. But we would have not bought our house had we 5 known that during the height of COVID, Open Road 6 Renewables began quietly signing leases for the 7 project a full five months before we bought. The 8 housing market is now vastly different than it was in 9 early 2020. There are higher prices in general and 10 higher mortgage rates. My family faces a significant 11 financial disadvantage to find a similar location due 12 to their covert business practices. 13 Five, electrical fires are an 14 increasingly common problem on solar installations and 15 are notoriously difficult to put out safely. And if 16 it does catch fire, burning heavy metals like the 17 cadmium telluride Craig Adair suggested might be used 18 at a Miller Township meeting becomes seriously toxic 19 as fumes. 20 Six, our winters freeze, which is a 21 danger to the solar tracking equipment needed to 22 follow the sun and maintain a safe panel angle during 23 high wind situations. Without the correct angle, the 24 panel arrays can gallop with winds at just 36 miles 25 per hour. Our small slice of Knox County has 596 1 experienced high wind events at least a couple of 2 times each year since we moved in, barely missing a 3 tornado by about four miles. 4 Seven, the technology is not very 5 efficient in Ohio's cloudy climate. Cloud cover 6 reduces the already dilute power output by roughly 70 7 to 90 percent. With more than half of our days 8 moderately to severely cloudy, this is a poor option 9 when we could explore alternatives like geothermal. 10 Eight, I don't believe in the integrity 11 of this development company. I think that they are 12 just here for the government subsidies and are merely 13 a glove corporation for the Eolian Investing Group 14 that manages a $100 billion in assets, shuffling shell 15 companies around in order to hide from being held 16 responsible from their promises. 17 And like the Blossom Project, Open Road 18 Renewables will likely sell and run as soon as the 19 project is approved, leaving the neighbors little 20 recourse if their promises prove hollow, as they did 21 in their Hillcrest Project, where investigators 22 discovered workers falsified state IDs that 23 temporarily lost them their pilot program approval. 24 Nine, Felicia Fields, who testified 25 here the first night, is a recruiter and on-site 597 1 coordinator for 360 Industrial Services, who advises 2 workers on Facebook from as far away as Texas to just 3 "Get an Ohio ID." Is that a local worker? There are 4 many outside voices like hers trying to get their 5 share. Some have obvious aspirations, while others 6 have clearly been hired. They'll tell you that there 7 is overwhelming support for the project, but most of 8 that comes from far outside the county. 9 Let the first night's local sign-in 10 numbers be your guide, with roughly 26.3 percent 11 pro-solar and 73.6 opposed. This climate hysteria 12 driven government funded out of state colonial 13 "plantationism" has no place in Knox County. Please 14 deny this project. Thank you. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Any questions from 16 counsel? 17 CROSS-EXAMINATION 18 BY MR. SETTINERI: 19 Q Good evening, Mrs. Dean. 20 A Hello. 21 Q Mike Settineri. Just some questions for 22 you. You're a member of Preserve Knox County, 23 correct? 24 A Yes, sir. 25 Q And when did you become a member? 598 1 A Near the beginning. 2 Q When did they begin? 3 A I'm afraid I don't know that 4 chronologically. 5 Q Spring of 2023 perhaps? 6 A Whenever the time is that they first sent 7 around the pages. 8 Q Sent around the what? 9 A The pages, the sign-up pages. 10 Q Now, you mentioned the Hillcrest Project in 11 your statement. 12 A I did. 13 Q Are you aware that another company built and 14 constructed that project, not Open Road? 15 A I am. Open Road sold it to them though. 16 Q Now your property, where you live today, is 17 surrounded by pretty good, dense woods, would you say? 18 A We are some of the few acres of woods. 19 There's some on Mr. Bob's property, but that's 20 considerably behind ours. We have some woods, but 21 most of it's behind us. 22 Q Okay. Let's make sure I have the right 23 drawing here. 24 MR. SETTINERI: Let's go ahead and mark 25 an exhibit, Frasier PH7, please. 599 1 (Frasier Exhibit PH7 was marked for 2 identification.) 3 JUDGE SANDOR: And what's the exhibit 4 of? 5 MR. SETTINERI: I'm sorry? 6 JUDGE SANDOR: Could you describe the 7 exhibit? 8 MR. SETTINERI: Oh, yeah, I will. It 9 is a -- again, it's two maps of the project 10 application with red arrows that are not in the 11 project. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 13 MR. SETTINERI: Thank you, Your Honor. 14 BY MR. SETTINERI: 15 Q I'm going to hand you a picture of PH7. Is 16 that an arrow pointing toward your residence? 17 A No, sir. 18 Q That's not your residence? 19 A It's pointing directly on top of it. 20 Q I'm sorry? 21 A It's pointing to the road in front of it. 22 Q Well, is your house -- let's be a little 23 more exact. The arrow is right on top of your house, 24 correct? 25 A Yes. 600 1 Q Okay. All right. And your house has woods 2 around the house, right? 3 A We have some trees. I would not call it 4 woods though. The woods are further back. 5 Q You reside at 6041 Sharp Road, is that 6 correct? 7 A Yes, sir. 8 MR. SETTINERI: Let's mark Frasier PH8, 9 Your Honor, which is just an exhibit for now. 10 (Frasier Exhibit PH8 was marked for 11 identification.) 12 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 13 Can you describe that again, actually? 14 MR. SETTINERI: Yeah, that's a Google 15 Map printout of 6041 Sharp Road. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 17 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 18 BY MR. SETTINERI: 19 Q Now, that -- is that where your house is? 20 A Yes. 21 Q Okay. And it looks like there are trees in 22 that area. It's a significant number of trees. Is 23 that fair to say? 24 A I would say about a dozen. 25 Q Okay. This picture is representative of the 601 1 woods and the trees around your house? 2 A Unfortunately, the shadows make it seem like 3 there's quite a bit more foliage. 4 Q Okay. Fair enough. Now, going back to what 5 I marked as Frasier PH7, with the arrow that's right 6 on top of your house, are you aware that initially, as 7 of June 2023, panels were proposed? You see right 8 where your house is on that top map with the arrow? 9 And you see the panels in the middle, I guess it would 10 be southeast and southwest of your house. Do you see 11 that? 12 A Yes, I do. 13 Q Did you have an opportunity to provide any 14 input to Frasier Solar between June and August of 15 2023? 16 A Are you referring to the meetings that were 17 at Panera? 18 Q Just in general, did you have an opportunity 19 to give any feedback to Frasier Solar about the panels 20 that were initially proposed in June of 2023 to be 21 near your house? 22 A I was provided the ability to give feedback, 23 yes, but I'm not sure when that was. I imagine it was 24 when you're saying it. 25 Q Okay. In the bottom one, August 2023, would 602 1 show the current proposed project and those panels 2 were removed, correct? 3 A I see that. I also see that a work landing 4 spot is also removed. 5 Q Okay. Great, thank you. And with that 6 removal, would you say the project would be 7 approximately -- the nearest project would be to your 8 house would be about a half mile or so? 9 A To my house? 10 Q Mm-hmm. 11 A No. No, my property only goes back a third 12 of a mile, and so even if it's just the property at 13 the very far back of my property, that's still less 14 than a third of a mile from my house. 15 Q Okay. So you're saying from your house to 16 the nearest project location on the road map, you 17 believe is over -- is about a third of a mile? 18 A It's closer than half a mile, it's about a 19 third of a mile. 20 Q All right. Now when you moved into Miller 21 Township, you accepted that living where you live 22 would include the sounds and smells of farming, 23 correct? 24 A Of course, those are intermittent. 25 Q And you also accepted that farming can 603 1 create dust, correct? 2 A Of course, that also is intermittent. 3 Q And you would like to have farming preserved 4 on the land where the project is proposed, correct? 5 A Yes, I would. 6 Q Okay. 7 A It's a farming neighborhood. 8 MR. SETTINERI: No further questions. 9 Thank you. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Questions from anyone 11 else? 12 Thank you for your testimony. 13 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 14 MR. SETTINERI: And, Your Honor, we'd 15 like to put Frasier PH7 and PH8 into the record. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Any objections? Hearing 17 none, Frasier PH7 and PH8 are admitted. 18 (Frasier Exhibit PH7 and Exhibit PH8 19 were received into evidence.) 20 All right. Our next registered witness 21 is Holly Hocott [sic]. 22 MS. P. HOCOTT: It's actually Polly 23 Hocott. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Polly, we apologize. 25 Are you an intervenor in this case? 604 1 MS. P. HOCOTT: No, I'm not. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: You're not? Okay, we 3 deeply apologize for mixing that up, and we appreciate 4 you waiting until near the end of all these hearings 5 to give your testimony this evening. 6 MS. P. HOCOTT: All right. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, please raise your 8 right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 9 MS. P. HOCOTT: I do. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: All right, please state 11 and spell your name for the record. 12 THE WITNESS: All right. Polly, 13 P-O-L-L-Y, Hocott, H-O-C-O-T-T. 722 East High Street, 14 Mount Vernon, Ohio, Clinton Township. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 16 reside within the project area? 17 THE WITNESS: No. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, thank you. Please 19 proceed. 20 DIRECT STATEMENT 21 THE WITNESS: I am opposed to the 22 Frasier Project. I'm concerned that they are not 23 listening to the people that live in Knox County. The 24 majority, 69 percent, are in opposition, and the 25 supporters, 31 percent, are mostly out of the project 605 1 area. People that don't live in Knox County should 2 have no voice in this decision. 3 My daughter and son, their children and 4 grandchildren live in the immediate area of this 5 project, and I'm concerned for their safety. This is 6 not in the best interest of the public, nor the safety 7 of their citizens. It would be a terrible mistake to 8 have the farmland and the beautiful fields turned into 9 solar panels that ruin the possibility of ever having 10 our food supply restored by removing topsoil that 11 never recovers in my lifetime. 12 We have "no solar" signs in our yards 13 from the very beginning and, yet, we have had students 14 knocking on our door multiple times trying to convince 15 us that what we have heard about solar is 16 misinformation. These students obviously are 17 benefiting from canvassing the neighborhoods and do 18 not live here. They attend college in the area and 19 all have the same addresses. They put their "yes 20 solar" signs in neighbor's yards, right beside the 21 candidate signs that are against solar, several times 22 without permission. 23 It is obviously apparent that Frasier 24 Solar is not concerned or listening to the people that 25 live here and those that it affects. We, the people 606 1 of Knox County, have stated our opposition. The 2 majority should move and that should be the end of 3 this travesty. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Any questions from 5 counsel? 6 Can I just clarify real quick? Do you 7 have family members who are intervenors in this 8 proceeding? 9 THE WITNESS: Yes. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: But you're not, correct? 11 THE WITNESS: I'm not. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, thank you. 13 All right, our next witness is Hannah 14 Gleespen. 15 Good evening. You are an intervenor in 16 this proceeding? 17 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. And you're aware 19 your counsel is not present tonight? 20 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 22 if you testify this evening, you'll be subject to 23 cross-examination without your counsel. 24 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: And in the alternative, 607 1 you could provide testimony at the August 2024 hearing 2 with counsel present? 3 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Do you choose to 5 testify tonight? 6 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please raise 8 your right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 9 MS. GLEESPEN: Yes, I do. 10 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state your name 11 and spell your name for the record. 12 THE WITNESS: Hannah Gleespen, H-A-N-N- 13 A-H G-L-E-E-S-P-E-N. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 15 address, including the township. 16 THE WITNESS: 5881 Sharp Road, Mount 17 Vernon, Ohio, Miller Township. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 19 reside within the project area? 20 THE WITNESS: I reside in it. I also 21 home school, but I work outside of the community. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Thank you. 23 Please proceed. 24 DIRECT STATEMENT 25 THE WITNESS: I oppose the Frasier 608 1 Solar Project. Citizens of Knox County do not want 2 this. We are a community of family and farmland. Our 3 roads are not prepared for it, not to mention that 4 dirt is a hindrance for solar panels and Ohio weather 5 is not reliable. We live close to two airports in 6 Knox County, where an obvious issue with glare from 7 solar fields is a cause for concern, as well as a 8 nuisance for neighbors. 9 Our community and some officials were 10 not informed and notified about this project in 11 accordance with timely requirements. The project was 12 hidden for most of us while those that did know 13 secretly signed contracts for money and to be quiet 14 and hide from us. We were devastated when we were 15 told about it. It was already a done deal by our 16 commissioner and that there was no one -- nothing we 17 could do about it, which was deceptive and dishonest. 18 We have worked countless hours to have 19 the house and property we have now, buying fixer- 20 uppers, rehabbing houses as we live in them and 21 reselling them to buy something nicer. We just 22 purchased our home in August and we have worked our 23 tails off to have the house that we have for the past 24 ten years. To raise our family close to family and in 25 the country, not in the middle of solar fields that 609 1 are going to affect our house value that we have 2 worked hard to build in our scenery and wildlife that 3 we get to see every single day. 4 The proposed contract will allow 5 cutting down ten acres of trees, which will affect 6 this wildlife per page 33 of the staff report. And 7 not only that, but will destroy farmland for locally 8 produced food and drain toxic waste into our fields, 9 which is very concerning for runoff going into the 10 ground while most of the surrounding areas have well 11 water. 12 We, as a community, don't want solar 13 fields and we don't see it as a good fit for our 14 community. I oppose the Frasier Solar Project. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Any questions from 16 counsel? 17 CROSS-EXAMINATION 18 BY MR. SETTINERI: 19 Q Good evening, Ms. Gleespen. Nice to meet 20 you. How long have you owned your house? 21 A Since August. 22 Q Of which year? 23 A 2023. 24 Q And you moved from where? 25 A Airport Road, Knox County. 610 1 Q Knox County, okay. And were you aware of 2 the project when you purchased your house? 3 A I was. 4 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. Your Honor, at 5 this time, I'd like to mark -- I think we're at 6 Frasier PH9. 7 (Frasier Exhibit PH9 was marked for 8 identification.) 9 JUDGE SANDOR: Thanks. 10 MR. SETTINERI: This is another set of 11 maps, an application with red arrows. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: Frasier PH9 is so 13 marked. 14 BY MR. SETTINERI: 15 Q Mrs. Gleespen, am I saying that right? 16 A Gleespen. 17 Q I want to give you a document marked Frasier 18 PH9 -- red arrow are not. Am I right that that red 19 arrow is either on or pointing to your property 20 directly? 21 THE REPORTER: Excuse me, sir, could 22 you please remove the paper from -- I'm so sorry. 23 MR. SETTINERI: All right. All right. 24 BY MR. SETTINERI: 25 Q And so now you bought your house in August 611 1 of 2023? 2 A Yes, sir. 3 Q Now, you were aware of the project prior to 4 that? 5 A Mm-hmm. 6 Q What was your awareness of the project prior 7 to buying your house? 8 A We were aware that we had been, even at our 9 previous address, we had been fighting it, and we had 10 had "no solar" signs, and all of that kind of stuff as 11 well. 12 Q Okay. So when you bought the house in 13 August -- let me get back up. In June, were you aware 14 that panels were proposed on either side, where that 15 red arrow is in the top map? 16 A Yes. 17 Q Okay. And then in August, obviously, those 18 panels -- you see the panels were removed, and it says 19 at the top of the map after community input. Do you 20 see that? 21 A Yes, I do. 22 Q All right. And in terms of buying that 23 property, with those panels being removed, did that 24 influence your purchase of the property? 25 A It did not. We have family in the 612 1 surrounding area, and we want to raise our family 2 close to family with the support of being a village. 3 Q And you're a member of Preserve Knox County, 4 correct? 5 A Yes, I am. 6 MR. SETTINERI: All right. I have no 7 further questions. Thank you. 8 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other questions? 10 All right. Thank you for your 11 testimony. 12 MR. SETTINERI: And, Your Honor, if I 13 could move for the admission for this hearing record 14 for Frasier PH9, please? 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Any objections? Hearing 16 none, Frasier PH9 is admitted. 17 (Frasier Exhibit PH9 was received into 18 evidence.) 19 Our next -- and as a heads up, there's 20 four more registered witnesses. Next is Candy Hocott. 21 MS. C. HOCOTT: Hi. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: Hello. You are an 23 intervenor in this case? 24 MS. C. HOCOTT: Yes, I am. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: You're aware your 613 1 counsel is not present this evening? 2 MS. C. HOCOTT: Yes. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: You acknowledge that if 4 you provide testimony this evening, you'll be subject 5 to cross-examination without your counsel present? 6 MS. C. HOCOTT: Yes. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: In the alternative, you 8 can provide testimony at the evidentiary hearing in 9 this proceeding with counsel. 10 MS. C. HOCOTT: I choose to speak here. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: And you choose to speak 12 here? Okay. Thank you. Please raise your right 13 hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 14 MS. C. HOCOTT: Yes, I do. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 16 your name for the record. 17 THE WITNESS: Candace Hocott, C- 18 A-N-D-I-C-E H-O-C-O-T-T. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 20 address, including the township. 21 THE WITNESS: 5840 Sharp Road, Mount 22 Vernon, Ohio, in Miller Township. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Do you work or reside 24 within the project area? 25 THE WITNESS: I reside in the project 614 1 area. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Please 3 proceed. 4 DIRECT STATEMENT 5 THE WITNESS: I just want to thank you 6 guys for taking the time to listen to all of us and 7 our concerns about the Frasier Solar Project and why I 8 strongly am opposed against it. First off, I just 9 want to let you guys know, I moved from Georgia. We 10 came -- we have family that live here and visited over 11 the years and loved the farmland here and fell in love 12 with Sharp Road and all the beautiful land out there. 13 We've now lived here for almost 18 14 years. Have a family of five and we have five 15 children, now have three grandchildren. So just love 16 being able to raise our kids on the farmland and not 17 be concerned about any city aspects. 18 We just found out, you know, we found 19 out about that Sharp Road was kind of in the ground 20 zero of all the solar projects. We were very, you 21 know, upset to hear about that because we, you know, 22 like I said, looking out at the beautiful cornfields, 23 watching the soybeans grow and the corn, and our kids 24 would go out and we'd measure their height up against 25 the corn stalks and all that. You know, we didn't 615 1 have that in Georgia. 2 And we've hosted many parties of people 3 that have come out from Columbus and other surrounding 4 cities that just fell in love with our area, and they 5 don't get an opportunity to see that, you know, in 6 that area. But we were, like I said, devastated to 7 find out the project was going to come there and a 8 negative impact it would be for us, for the community. 9 The proposed project will ruin many of 10 the things that make our area special and the 11 potential to cause major harm to the land as well as 12 the people living here. As a mother and a 13 grandmother, I am extremely concerned about the 14 potential dangers that the solar panels can and have 15 caused in other areas, which may -- which many others 16 have gone on into already. I want my grandchildren to 17 be able to grow up in a peaceful, rural setting and 18 not surrounded by industrial solar fields. 19 I also believe that taking prime 20 farmland and turning it into industrial solar fields 21 is a horrible idea. They aren't making any more 22 farmlands so protecting our own farmlands is very 23 important. The negative impact on our property values 24 is also very troubling to me. 25 The bottom line is that the vast 616 1 majority of the people in this community do not want 2 this project to happen. And as in recent election 3 results in Township anti-solar resolutions have 4 proven. This is what should matter, not the opinions 5 of the outsiders from Columbus or any other areas, 6 states, or wherever they're outside of our community. 7 I respectfully and passionately ask 8 that the board deny this project and let us all get 9 back to our peaceful lives in the community that we 10 all love. Thank you. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Any questions from 12 counsel? 13 CROSS-EXAMINATION 14 BY MR. SETTINERI: 15 Q Good evening. 16 A Hi. 17 Q You're a member of Preserve Knox County? 18 A Yes. 19 Q And you're an intervenor. 20 A Yep. 21 Q Now, you live just southeast of Ms. 22 Gleespen, right? 23 A Yeah. 24 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. Your Honor, I'll 25 just mark as Frasier PH10, another series of maps 617 1 before and after community input. 2 (Frasier Exhibit PH10 was marked for 3 identification.) 4 JUDGE SANDOR: So marked. 5 BY MR. SETTINERI: 6 Q I'm going to give you a map, as a 7 representative of the project application, the top one 8 before and after community input, the bottom and after 9 community input, the red arrows are not in the 10 application. But am I correct that generally that red 11 arrow on both maps is pointing towards your residents? 12 A Yes. 13 Q Okay. And were you aware that in June there 14 were panels located to the east and west -- proposed 15 to be installed to the east and west of your home? 16 A Yes. 17 Q And then were you able to give input to 18 Frasier Solar about those panels specifically? 19 A Not personally to that. Well, I mean, we've 20 been to some of the township trustee meetings and have 21 spoke our opinions there. 22 Q Okay. 23 A I have also emailed our, you know, 24 counsel -- commissioners and things like that for it 25 too, that we oppose it. 618 1 Q Okay. And so you know, as of August when 2 the application was filed, those panels were removed 3 to the east and west of your house? 4 A That's what they say. 5 MR. SETTINERI: No further questions. 6 Thank you. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other questions? 8 Nope. 9 Thank you for your testimony. 10 MR. SETTINERI: If we can move for the 11 admission of Frasier PH10, into the hearing record, 12 please. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: Any objections? Hearing 14 none, Frasier PH10 is admitted. 15 (Frasier Exhibit PH10 was received into 16 evidence.) 17 Our next witness is Emily Rowley. 18 Good evening. You're an intervenor in 19 this proceeding? 20 MS. ROWLEY: Yes, I am. 21 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. You're aware 22 your counsel is not present this evening? 23 MS. ROWLEY: Yes, I am. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 25 if you provide testimony this evening that you'll be 619 1 subject to cross-examination without your counsel 2 present? 3 MS. ROWLEY: I am aware. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: And in the alternative, 5 you can provide testimony at the evidentiary hearing 6 in this proceeding with counsel present? 7 MS. ROWLEY: I understand that. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. And you 9 choose to testify? 10 MS. ROWLEY: I choose to testify. 11 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, please raise your 12 right hand. Do you swear to tell the truth? 13 MS. ROWLEY: I do. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 15 your name to the record. 16 THE WITNESS: My name is Emily Rowley, 17 E-M-I-L-Y R-O-W-L-E-Y. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 19 address, including the township. 20 THE WITNESS: My address is 5224 21 Lafayette Road, Mount Vernon. The township is Miller. 22 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 23 reside in the project area? 24 THE WITNESS: I do both. 25 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. Please 620 1 proceed. 2 DIRECT STATEMENT 3 THE WITNESS: Thank you for giving us 4 the opportunity to voice our concerns. I am opposed 5 to the Frasier Solar Project. Unlike the landowners 6 who leased their land for the projects, I live in the 7 project area with my husband and three small children. 8 In fact, if this project is approved, 9 there will be no place that we can stand on our 10 property and not see solar panels. We will be 11 surrounded. Our home sits atop a hill overlooking the 12 proposed project. No amount of screening and 13 landscaping will be a benefit because of how our home 14 is placed. 15 You see, we are in such an impossible 16 situation that Frasier Solar verbally said they would 17 offer us a purchase option agreement. That agreement 18 came with a caveat. We could no longer speak out in 19 opposition. Wouldn't a good neighbor allow someone to 20 express their deep concerns about the future for their 21 family and community without trying to silence them, 22 remove them from the home they intend to raise their 23 children in? Our story and our voice must be 24 powerful. 25 We moved into our home in November of 621 1 2020. We can see my in-laws' farm from our home, as 2 well as my husband's uncle's farm that used to be his 3 grandparents. Selling our old home and buying this 4 home helped put us in a financial situation that 5 allows me to stay home with our children. It's 6 everything my husband and myself has ever dreamed of 7 for ourselves and our children until now. 8 The current landowner who's leasing the 9 land to Frasier Solar did not own the land when we 10 purchased our home. When we found out that the 11 current landowner had purchased the land, we reached 12 out in hopes to buy some of the land from him. He 13 said he had no desire to sell the land. Little did we 14 know, he would soon sell out to Frasier Solar. 15 When I asked Matt Butler last week if 16 the OPSB staff comes to all of the sites of the 17 proposed project, I was surprised to learn his answer. 18 Yes, they do. 19 On page nine of the staff report, it 20 states, "Staff recommends that aesthetic impact 21 mitigation include native vegetation planning, 22 alternative fencing, good neighbor agreements, or 23 other methods in consultation with effective 24 landowners and subject to staff review. With 25 implementation of the staff's condition, the overall 622 1 expected aesthetic impact would be minimal." I'm not 2 sure the OPSB staff would find the expected aesthetic 3 impact to be minimal in the case of my family. 4 On page 53, condition ten, the staff 5 report states, "Prior to commencement of construction, 6 the applicant shall file a landscape and lighting plan 7 in consultation with a landscape architect that 8 addresses the aesthetic and lighting impacts of the 9 facility. That plan shall include any adjacent non- 10 participating parcel containing a resident, residents 11 with a direct line of sight to the fence of the 12 facility. The plan shall provide for the planting of 13 vegetative screening designed by the landscape 14 architect to enhance the view from the residence, 15 unless alternative mitigation measures are agreed to 16 with the property owner." 17 Again, there's nothing that can be done 18 to enhance the view from our residence. This 19 condition will not be able to be met by Frasier Solar. 20 Our current Knox County Commissioner 21 signed a resolution on August 11th of 2022 stating 22 they would look at industrial solar projects in a 23 case-by-case basis. One of the criteria to 24 considering large-scale facilities is the ability to 25 provide buffers between the facility and adjacent 623 1 landowners. You must understand our frustration. 2 Time and time again we're reading and 3 hearing about the importance of buffers, screening, 4 landscaping and knowing that in our situation it does 5 not matter. There's nothing they can do. 6 We hear the argument that we shouldn't 7 be able to tell someone what they can or cannot do 8 with their land. That's rich considering only one of 9 the landowners who have leased their land actually 10 lives in the project area. Also this is not really a 11 matter of telling someone what they can or cannot do 12 with their land. This is a matter of local residents 13 voicing their concerns for what the future of their 14 community looks like in the realms of zoning. 15 On page eight, paragraph five of the 16 staff report, it is acknowledged that Frasier Solar is 17 developing a commercial operation. This is not an 18 agricultural operation. If an Amazon warehouse put 19 some sheep in front of their building, would it 20 suddenly become agricultural? 21 I have so many concerns we would be 22 here all night if I started sharing them. Thankfully 23 my friends, my family, my neighbors have brought a 24 majority of those concerns to you. I hear the 25 pro-industrial solar sites say that this proposed 624 1 project only impacts a small percentage of farmlands 2 in Knox County. Well, the majority of that farmland 3 surrounds my entire world. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: Take a moment, if you 5 need. It's okay. 6 THE WITNESS: I rest in the comfort of 7 Jeremiah 29:11, "For I know the plans I have for you, 8 says the Lord. They are plans for good and not for 9 despair, to give you a future and a hope." 10 I ask you to please deny approval of 11 the Frasier Solar project on behalf of my family, my 12 friends, and my neighbors who are most impacted by the 13 project. 14 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. 15 Any questions from counsel? 16 MR. SETTINERI: No questions, thank 17 you. 18 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay. Any other 19 questions? 20 All right. Thank you for your 21 testimony. 22 Our next registered witness is Johnny 23 Hocott. All right, hearing -- oh, there he is. 24 You are an intervenor? 25 MR. HOCOTT: Yes. 625 1 JUDGE SANDOR: Correct? Okay. And 2 you're aware of counsel's not present this evening? 3 MR. HOCOTT: Yes. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 5 if you testify tonight, you'll be subject to 6 cross-examination without your counsel present? 7 MR. HOCOTT: Yes. 8 JUDGE SANDOR: And in the alternative, 9 you provide testimony at the evidentiary hearing with 10 your counsel present? 11 MR. HOCOTT: Yes. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: And you choose to 13 testify tonight? 14 MR. HOCOTT: I do. 15 JUDGE SANDOR: All right, thank you. 16 Please raise your right hand. Do you swear to tell 17 the truth? 18 MR. HOCOTT: I do. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 20 your name for the record. 21 THE WITNESS: Johnny Hocott, J-O-H-N-N- 22 Y H-O-C-O-T-T. 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 24 address, including the township. 25 THE WITNESS: 5840 Sharp Road, in 626 1 Miller. 2 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 3 reside in the project area? 4 THE WITNESS: I do. 5 JUDGE SANDOR: I'm sorry? 6 THE WITNESS: I do. Actually both. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Both, okay. Please 8 proceed. 9 DIRECT STATEMENT 10 THE WITNESS: Okay. I want to start by 11 thanking the board for the opportunity to express my 12 opposition to the Frasier Solar Project. My wife and 13 I are from Georgia. We lived there for the first 36 14 years of our lives. Never thought we'd live anywhere 15 else. 16 In 2006, we came to housesit for my 17 sister and brother-in-law who lived on Sharp Road. 18 While we were here, we fell in love with Mount Vernon 19 and especially Sharp Road area due to the gorgeous 20 views of the farmland as well as the laid-back 21 lifestyle. We went back to Georgia and immediately 22 put our home up for sale and moved to Mount Vernon. 23 We could have moved anywhere we wanted to, but we 24 chose Mount Vernon and more precisely Sharp Road. 25 My daughter and son-in-law also chose 627 1 to buy a house on Sharp Road to raise their three 2 girls. Those girls deserve to grow up in a community 3 that we all fell in love with and not be surrounded by 4 industrial solar. I think it'd be an utter travesty 5 to allow the raping of our beautiful farm community so 6 that the electricity produced from it could be shipped 7 off to Licking County. I would not be for it, even if 8 the electricity was staying in Knox County. 9 Using prime farmland for these 10 so-called farmland -- solar farms is a horrible idea. 11 In my opinion, this project is fueled by greed and the 12 vast majority of the people that have spoken in favor 13 of it at these meetings either do not live in the 14 affected area or are profiting from it by leasing 15 their land to Frasier or getting the hush money that 16 Frasier likes to call the "good neighbor program." 17 I would also like to call attention to 18 the disgusting ads that Frasier has put out about this 19 so-called dark money that is supposedly the driving 20 force behind the opposition to their project. Dark 21 money, I guess they mean money from hard-working 22 people like myself and my wife, as well as countless 23 others in this room that have had to contribute their 24 own hard-earned money that they could use for about a 25 thousand other things to fight this invasion of our 628 1 community. We've all had to put our lives on hold to 2 fight this, which has cost us both time and money. 3 Lastly, I want to urge the board to 4 look at the turnout that's happened in the last three 5 meetings about this project. Frasier would love for 6 you to believe that the community's evenly split, but 7 that's a joke. The vast majority of those in favor of 8 this project that have spoken at these meetings don't 9 live in Knox County. Why should people from Columbus 10 and other parts of the state have the say so and what 11 happens in our community? 12 As others have stated, the recent 13 county commissioners races in Knox County were both 14 overwhelmingly won by candidates that were an adamant 15 opposition to solar and ran primarily on the solar 16 issue. 17 In closing, I ask that the board take 18 all this into account, deny this project, and help us 19 keep our amazing farm community intact. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Questions? 21 CROSS-EXAMINATION 22 BY MR. SETTINERI: 23 Q Good evening, Mr. Hocott. A couple quick 24 questions. What's your address currently? 25 A 5840 Sharp Road. 629 1 Q All right. Do you rent there? 2 A Yes, we do. 3 Q Okay. Who do you rent from? 4 A My sister and brother-in-law. 5 Q Who are they? 6 A Gary and -- 7 Q Okay. And you're a member of Preserve Knox 8 County? 9 A I am. 10 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. No further 11 questions. Thank you. 12 JUDGE SANDOR: Any other questions? 13 All right. Thank you for your 14 testimony. 15 And last but not least, Samuel 16 Gleespen. 17 MR. GLEESPEN: She forgot to put hers 18 in the box. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: That's fine. You can 20 bring it up to the box. That's okay. Thank you. 21 MR. GLEESPEN: Is it all right if I put 22 these in the box? 23 JUDGE SANDOR: Yes. Yes. And you are 24 an intervenor? 25 MR. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 630 1 JUDGE SANDOR: All right. You're aware 2 your counsel is not present this evening? 3 MR. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 4 JUDGE SANDOR: And you acknowledge that 5 if you provide testimony this evening that you're 6 subject to cross-examination without your counsel 7 present? 8 MR. GLEESPEN: Yes, sir. 9 JUDGE SANDOR: And you have the 10 alternative to provide testimony at the evidentiary 11 hearing with counsel present. 12 MR. GLEESPEN: Mm-hmm. 13 JUDGE SANDOR: And you choose to 14 testify tonight? 15 MR. GLEESPEN: Absolutely. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: All right, thank you. 17 Please raise your right hand. Do you swear to tell 18 the truth? 19 MR. GLEESPEN: Yes. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: Please state and spell 21 your name for the record. 22 THE WITNESS: Samuel S-A-M-U-E-L 23 Gleespen, G-L-E-E-S-P-E-N. 24 JUDGE SANDOR: Please provide your 25 address, including the township. 631 1 THE WITNESS: 5881 Sharp Road. That's 2 Miller. 3 JUDGE SANDOR: And do you work or 4 reside within the project area? 5 THE WITNESS: I reside. I work 6 outside. 7 JUDGE SANDOR: Okay, thank you. 8 DIRECT STATEMENT 9 THE WITNESS: All right. Solar comes 10 with too many unknowns and the facts that are out 11 there are from the same companies selling you the 12 product. They would never say anything too bad about 13 it because your "yes" lines their pockets. There are 14 too many unknowns and downsides to comprehend. And 15 four years is a long time to test that theory out. 16 I refuse to stand idly by and watch the 17 town I'm currently raising my three kids in get bought 18 out by greedy corporations like Frasier Solar just 19 because they thought we were an easy target. The 20 truth of the matter is the majority of Knox County -- 21 the majority of Knox community and the people in this 22 project affects, they don't want solar panels, and the 23 whole reason the county voted the way they did for the 24 commissioners was on the solar issue. 25 If we want to look to the future of a 632 1 community we need to focus on families and small 2 businesses, not big corporations moving in and buying 3 their way into our lands with their good neighbor 4 acts. The amount of good neighboring that I've seen 5 in just these meetings alone is staggering from people 6 outside the county who shouldn't have an opinion on 7 who deserves or needs solar in Knox County. 8 As I've stated I will not lie down on 9 this issue just because it's convenient to do so. 10 I've had to put my life on hold, and I will continue 11 to do that until Frasier is gone. Solar is an 12 inefficient, expensive energy source that's more 13 trouble than it's worth, especially in 40 years. 14 Frasier Solar is a disease and their practices are a 15 disease to the community, and I will fight to the 16 bitter end to see them out. 17 I will raise my family in a solar free 18 environment. I oppose the Frasier Solar project. 19 JUDGE SANDOR: Questions from counsel? 20 CROSS-EXAMINATION 21 BY MR. SETTINERI: 22 Q Good evening, Mr. Gleespen. 23 A Good evening. 24 Q You're an intervenor in the case? 25 A Yes, sir. 633 1 Q A member of Preserve Knox County? 2 A Absolutely. 3 Q Have you had an opportunity to review the 4 staff report and the staff's recommended conditions? 5 A I have but, from memory -- I mean, you 6 have it right there, so I can -- 7 Q It's fine, just want to make sure you read 8 it. And then also, you live at 5881 Sharp Road, 9 right? 10 A Yes, sir. 11 Q And is Mrs. Hannah Gleespen, that's your 12 wife? 13 A Yes. 14 MR. SETTINERI: Okay. Good enough. No 15 further questions. Thank you. 16 JUDGE SANDOR: Thank you. Any other 17 questions? Hearing none, thank you very much for your 18 testimony. 19 THE WITNESS: Thank you. 20 JUDGE SANDOR: All right, we've reached 21 the end of the list of registered witnesses for the 22 local public hearing in this case. The board 23 appreciates your participation in embarking on this 24 three-hearing journey with us. Just as a reminder, 25 everyone -- or just as a reminder, the evidentiary 634 1 hearing begins August 19, 2024, at the -- offices in 2 Columbus. 3 And with that, we are adjourned. Thank 4 you very much. 5 THE REPORTER: We're going to go off 6 the record at 9:34 p.m. 7 (Whereupon, at 9:34 p.m., the 8 proceeding was concluded.) 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 635 1 CERTIFICATE 2 I, NIC JOSEPH, the officer before whom the 3 foregoing proceedings were taken, do hereby certify 4 that any witness(es) in the foregoing proceedings, 5 prior to testifying, were duly sworn; that the 6 proceedings were recorded by me and thereafter reduced 7 to typewriting by a qualified transcriptionist; that 8 said digital audio recording of said proceedings are a 9 true and accurate record to the best of my knowledge, 10 skills, and ability; that I am neither counsel for, 11 related to, nor employed by any of the parties to the 12 action in which this was taken; and, further, that I 13 am not a relative or employee of any counsel or 14 attorney employed by the parties hereto, nor 15 financially or otherwise interested in the outcome of 16 this action. 17 <%25587,Signature%> 18 NIC JOSEPH 19 Notary Public in and for the 20 State of Ohio 21 22 23 24 25 636 1 CERTIFICATE OF TRANSCRIBER 2 I, ALEXIS GALLO, do hereby certify that this 3 transcript was prepared from the digital audio 4 recording of the foregoing proceeding, that said 5 transcript is a true and accurate record of the 6 proceedings to the best of my knowledge, skills, and 7 ability; that I am neither counsel for, related to, 8 nor employed by any of the parties to the action in 9 which this was taken; and, further, that I am not a 10 relative or employee of any counsel or attorney 11 employed by the parties hereto, nor financially or 12 otherwise interested in the outcome of this action. 13 14 <%26289,Signature%> 15 ALEXIS GALLO 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25